I have been using computers ever since they came out (It was my job). I have
built, repaired, and modified computers. I can program in several languages.
And my wife has a new HP with Vista. After reading the messages and pleas
for help in this newsgroup and others, if anyone will be honest enough,
they will agree that Vista has gone overboard with security. Vista has
sucked ALL the FUN out of computing. I surf the web all the time and with a
few precautions, I have never had any problems from hackers. Long story
short...I HOPE VISTA FAILS AND IS NOT ACCEPTED BY THE PUBLIC. From reading
this newsgroup and others, there are many, many dissatisfied customers.
When my ME and XP computers can no longer be repaired, if Vista is all that
is available, I will NEVER get on a computer again.
Paul

"Paul" <Paul@SBCmetro.com> wrote in message
news:ix0%h.575$LR5.512@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
>I have been using computers ever since they came out (It was my job). I
>have
> built, repaired, and modified computers. I can program in several
> languages.
> And my wife has a new HP with Vista. After reading the messages and pleas
> for help in this newsgroup and others,

What part of "support newsgroup" do you not understand? If you were going to
check on the general health of the population, would you go to a hospital?
You would end up determining that everyone in the world is sick?

> if anyone will be honest enough,
> they will agree that Vista has gone overboard with security.

Does this mean that everyone who disagrees with your point of view must be
dishonest?

>Vista has
> sucked ALL the FUN out of computing. I surf the web all the time and with
> a
> few precautions, I have never had any problems from hackers. Long story
> short...I HOPE VISTA FAILS AND IS NOT ACCEPTED BY THE PUBLIC. From reading
> this newsgroup and others, there are many, many dissatisfied customers.
> When my ME and XP computers can no longer be repaired, if Vista is all
> that
> is available, I will NEVER get on a computer again.
> Paul

So, Microsoft should base it's new operating system on your own personal
experiences and disregard the experiences of all the other millions of
users?

Don't learn anything new, Paul, just stay enclosed in your own little narrow
world.

--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User

I enjoy Vista, and think it is fun. A lot of people don't like XP at all,
and go with 98 or 2000. That's their opinion. But, if your only source of
information is reading about other peoples problems, I agree with Ronnie
Vernon. You can't get an overall picture of satisfaction by looking at the
bad part of town. Not too many people go out of their ways to say positive
things in here.

And your last statement "When my ME and XP computers can no longer be
repaired...", got me confused. ME is fun?


--
Dustin Harper
dharper@vistarip.com
http://www.vistarip.com

--
"Paul" <Paul@SBCmetro.com> wrote in message
news:ix0%h.575$LR5.512@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
>I have been using computers ever since they came out (It was my job). I
>have
> built, repaired, and modified computers. I can program in several
> languages.
> And my wife has a new HP with Vista. After reading the messages and pleas
> for help in this newsgroup and others, if anyone will be honest enough,
> they will agree that Vista has gone overboard with security. Vista has
> sucked ALL the FUN out of computing. I surf the web all the time and with
> a
> few precautions, I have never had any problems from hackers. Long story
> short...I HOPE VISTA FAILS AND IS NOT ACCEPTED BY THE PUBLIC. From reading
> this newsgroup and others, there are many, many dissatisfied customers.
> When my ME and XP computers can no longer be repaired, if Vista is all
> that
> is available, I will NEVER get on a computer again.
> Paul
>
>

I think that Vista is fun to use, although UAC is a bit overboard in its
execution, with the whole black out the screen when a a discreet dialogue
would have done, I for one can't stand it, but thats my opinion.
Also on what many people feel as removing fun is the wee bugs here and there
e.g.Open Reliability and Performance Monitor, go to View>Customize, then try
and X out of the dialgoue, does nothing, but wee niggles will improve with
time and it will be as good in a few years as XP is today.

"Dustin Harper" wrote:

> I enjoy Vista, and think it is fun. A lot of people don't like XP at all,
> and go with 98 or 2000. That's their opinion. But, if your only source of
> information is reading about other peoples problems, I agree with Ronnie
> Vernon. You can't get an overall picture of satisfaction by looking at the
> bad part of town. Not too many people go out of their ways to say positive
> things in here.
>
> And your last statement "When my ME and XP computers can no longer be
> repaired...", got me confused. ME is fun?
>
>
> --
> Dustin Harper
> dharper@vistarip.com
> http://www.vistarip.com
>
> --
> "Paul" <Paul@SBCmetro.com> wrote in message
> news:ix0%h.575$LR5.512@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
> >I have been using computers ever since they came out (It was my job). I
> >have
> > built, repaired, and modified computers. I can program in several
> > languages.
> > And my wife has a new HP with Vista. After reading the messages and pleas
> > for help in this newsgroup and others, if anyone will be honest enough,
> > they will agree that Vista has gone overboard with security. Vista has
> > sucked ALL the FUN out of computing. I surf the web all the time and with
> > a
> > few precautions, I have never had any problems from hackers. Long story
> > short...I HOPE VISTA FAILS AND IS NOT ACCEPTED BY THE PUBLIC. From reading
> > this newsgroup and others, there are many, many dissatisfied customers.
> > When my ME and XP computers can no longer be repaired, if Vista is all
> > that
> > is available, I will NEVER get on a computer again.
> > Paul
> >
> >
>

JD

UAC has 2 separate components. One is the displayed dialog asking for
permission and the other is the Secure Destop (The dimmed screen) which
prevents anything from running until you OK the requested action.

--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


"JD" <JD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:AE4687FE-7D58-4686-A1DA-2EDD8C6E7FD3@microsoft.com...
>I think that Vista is fun to use, although UAC is a bit overboard in its
> execution, with the whole black out the screen when a a discreet dialogue
> would have done, I for one can't stand it, but thats my opinion.
> Also on what many people feel as removing fun is the wee bugs here and
> there
> e.g.Open Reliability and Performance Monitor, go to View>Customize, then
> try
> and X out of the dialgoue, does nothing, but wee niggles will improve with
> time and it will be as good in a few years as XP is today.
>
> "Dustin Harper" wrote:
>
>> I enjoy Vista, and think it is fun. A lot of people don't like XP at all,
>> and go with 98 or 2000. That's their opinion. But, if your only source of
>> information is reading about other peoples problems, I agree with Ronnie
>> Vernon. You can't get an overall picture of satisfaction by looking at
>> the
>> bad part of town. Not too many people go out of their ways to say
>> positive
>> things in here.
>>
>> And your last statement "When my ME and XP computers can no longer be
>> repaired...", got me confused. ME is fun?
>>
>>
>> --
>> Dustin Harper
>> dharper@vistarip.com
>> http://www.vistarip.com
>>
>> --
>> "Paul" <Paul@SBCmetro.com> wrote in message
>> news:ix0%h.575$LR5.512@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
>> >I have been using computers ever since they came out (It was my job). I
>> >have
>> > built, repaired, and modified computers. I can program in several
>> > languages.
>> > And my wife has a new HP with Vista. After reading the messages and
>> > pleas
>> > for help in this newsgroup and others, if anyone will be honest
>> > enough,
>> > they will agree that Vista has gone overboard with security. Vista has
>> > sucked ALL the FUN out of computing. I surf the web all the time and
>> > with
>> > a
>> > few precautions, I have never had any problems from hackers. Long story
>> > short...I HOPE VISTA FAILS AND IS NOT ACCEPTED BY THE PUBLIC. From
>> > reading
>> > this newsgroup and others, there are many, many dissatisfied customers.
>> > When my ME and XP computers can no longer be repaired, if Vista is all
>> > that
>> > is available, I will NEVER get on a computer again.
>> > Paul
>> >
>> >
>>

I really like and enjoy using Vista. The more I use it and learn about how
to use it the more I like it. Almost every thing I do can be done with a
click or two. No commands to type in. In my world, Vista has put the FUN in
computing. Hey, and Bill needs the money.

"Ronnie Vernon MVP" wrote:

> JD
>
> UAC has 2 separate components. One is the displayed dialog asking for
> permission and the other is the Secure Destop (The dimmed screen) which
> prevents anything from running until you OK the requested action.
>
> --
>
> Ronnie Vernon
> Microsoft MVP
> Windows Shell/User
>
>
> "JD" <JD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:AE4687FE-7D58-4686-A1DA-2EDD8C6E7FD3@microsoft.com...
> >I think that Vista is fun to use, although UAC is a bit overboard in its
> > execution, with the whole black out the screen when a a discreet dialogue
> > would have done, I for one can't stand it, but thats my opinion.
> > Also on what many people feel as removing fun is the wee bugs here and
> > there
> > e.g.Open Reliability and Performance Monitor, go to View>Customize, then
> > try
> > and X out of the dialgoue, does nothing, but wee niggles will improve with
> > time and it will be as good in a few years as XP is today.
> >
> > "Dustin Harper" wrote:
> >
> >> I enjoy Vista, and think it is fun. A lot of people don't like XP at all,
> >> and go with 98 or 2000. That's their opinion. But, if your only source of
> >> information is reading about other peoples problems, I agree with Ronnie
> >> Vernon. You can't get an overall picture of satisfaction by looking at
> >> the
> >> bad part of town. Not too many people go out of their ways to say
> >> positive
> >> things in here.
> >>
> >> And your last statement "When my ME and XP computers can no longer be
> >> repaired...", got me confused. ME is fun?
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Dustin Harper
> >> dharper@vistarip.com
> >> http://www.vistarip.com
> >>
> >> --
> >> "Paul" <Paul@SBCmetro.com> wrote in message
> >> news:ix0%h.575$LR5.512@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
> >> >I have been using computers ever since they came out (It was my job). I
> >> >have
> >> > built, repaired, and modified computers. I can program in several
> >> > languages.
> >> > And my wife has a new HP with Vista. After reading the messages and
> >> > pleas
> >> > for help in this newsgroup and others, if anyone will be honest
> >> > enough,
> >> > they will agree that Vista has gone overboard with security. Vista has
> >> > sucked ALL the FUN out of computing. I surf the web all the time and
> >> > with
> >> > a
> >> > few precautions, I have never had any problems from hackers. Long story
> >> > short...I HOPE VISTA FAILS AND IS NOT ACCEPTED BY THE PUBLIC. From
> >> > reading
> >> > this newsgroup and others, there are many, many dissatisfied customers.
> >> > When my ME and XP computers can no longer be repaired, if Vista is all
> >> > that
> >> > is available, I will NEVER get on a computer again.
> >> > Paul
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
>

Ronnie

Doesn't change the fact that it is poorly executed and annoying, why not
just the dialog but give it an "always on top feature" like Task Manager,
means it can'y be ignored but is less obtrusive than the dim screen, whats a
novice gonna think when they see that?

"Ronnie Vernon MVP" wrote:

> JD
>
> UAC has 2 separate components. One is the displayed dialog asking for
> permission and the other is the Secure Destop (The dimmed screen) which
> prevents anything from running until you OK the requested action.
>
> --
>
> Ronnie Vernon
> Microsoft MVP
> Windows Shell/User
>
>
> "JD" <JD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:AE4687FE-7D58-4686-A1DA-2EDD8C6E7FD3@microsoft.com...
> >I think that Vista is fun to use, although UAC is a bit overboard in its
> > execution, with the whole black out the screen when a a discreet dialogue
> > would have done, I for one can't stand it, but thats my opinion.
> > Also on what many people feel as removing fun is the wee bugs here and
> > there
> > e.g.Open Reliability and Performance Monitor, go to View>Customize, then
> > try
> > and X out of the dialgoue, does nothing, but wee niggles will improve with
> > time and it will be as good in a few years as XP is today.
> >
> > "Dustin Harper" wrote:
> >
> >> I enjoy Vista, and think it is fun. A lot of people don't like XP at all,
> >> and go with 98 or 2000. That's their opinion. But, if your only source of
> >> information is reading about other peoples problems, I agree with Ronnie
> >> Vernon. You can't get an overall picture of satisfaction by looking at
> >> the
> >> bad part of town. Not too many people go out of their ways to say
> >> positive
> >> things in here.
> >>
> >> And your last statement "When my ME and XP computers can no longer be
> >> repaired...", got me confused. ME is fun?
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Dustin Harper
> >> dharper@vistarip.com
> >> http://www.vistarip.com
> >>
> >> --
> >> "Paul" <Paul@SBCmetro.com> wrote in message
> >> news:ix0%h.575$LR5.512@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
> >> >I have been using computers ever since they came out (It was my job). I
> >> >have
> >> > built, repaired, and modified computers. I can program in several
> >> > languages.
> >> > And my wife has a new HP with Vista. After reading the messages and
> >> > pleas
> >> > for help in this newsgroup and others, if anyone will be honest
> >> > enough,
> >> > they will agree that Vista has gone overboard with security. Vista has
> >> > sucked ALL the FUN out of computing. I surf the web all the time and
> >> > with
> >> > a
> >> > few precautions, I have never had any problems from hackers. Long story
> >> > short...I HOPE VISTA FAILS AND IS NOT ACCEPTED BY THE PUBLIC. From
> >> > reading
> >> > this newsgroup and others, there are many, many dissatisfied customers.
> >> > When my ME and XP computers can no longer be repaired, if Vista is all
> >> > that
> >> > is available, I will NEVER get on a computer again.
> >> > Paul
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
>

JD

Without the secure desktop, the UAC prompt would be meaningless since any
malware could easily spoof the UAC prompt. The secure desktop backs up the
UAC prompt by making it impossible for any action to take place until the
user gives their permission.

When you have a few minutes to spare, check the following link. This gives a
very good description of how different operating systems implement this
process.

Comparison of privilege authorization features:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compari...ation_features


--

Ronnie Vernon
Microsoft MVP
Windows Shell/User


"JD" <JD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:FCB76147-E9E2-447D-91C8-B72ADA633A60@microsoft.com...
> Ronnie
>
> Doesn't change the fact that it is poorly executed and annoying, why not
> just the dialog but give it an "always on top feature" like Task Manager,
> means it can'y be ignored but is less obtrusive than the dim screen, whats
> a
> novice gonna think when they see that?
>
> "Ronnie Vernon MVP" wrote:
>
>> JD
>>
>> UAC has 2 separate components. One is the displayed dialog asking for
>> permission and the other is the Secure Destop (The dimmed screen) which
>> prevents anything from running until you OK the requested action.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Ronnie Vernon
>> Microsoft MVP
>> Windows Shell/User
>>
>>
>> "JD" <JD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:AE4687FE-7D58-4686-A1DA-2EDD8C6E7FD3@microsoft.com...
>> >I think that Vista is fun to use, although UAC is a bit overboard in its
>> > execution, with the whole black out the screen when a a discreet
>> > dialogue
>> > would have done, I for one can't stand it, but thats my opinion.
>> > Also on what many people feel as removing fun is the wee bugs here and
>> > there
>> > e.g.Open Reliability and Performance Monitor, go to View>Customize,
>> > then
>> > try
>> > and X out of the dialgoue, does nothing, but wee niggles will improve
>> > with
>> > time and it will be as good in a few years as XP is today.
>> >
>> > "Dustin Harper" wrote:
>> >
>> >> I enjoy Vista, and think it is fun. A lot of people don't like XP at
>> >> all,
>> >> and go with 98 or 2000. That's their opinion. But, if your only source
>> >> of
>> >> information is reading about other peoples problems, I agree with
>> >> Ronnie
>> >> Vernon. You can't get an overall picture of satisfaction by looking at
>> >> the
>> >> bad part of town. Not too many people go out of their ways to say
>> >> positive
>> >> things in here.
>> >>
>> >> And your last statement "When my ME and XP computers can no longer be
>> >> repaired...", got me confused. ME is fun?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Dustin Harper
>> >> dharper@vistarip.com
>> >> http://www.vistarip.com
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> "Paul" <Paul@SBCmetro.com> wrote in message
>> >> news:ix0%h.575$LR5.512@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
>> >> >I have been using computers ever since they came out (It was my job).
>> >> >I
>> >> >have
>> >> > built, repaired, and modified computers. I can program in several
>> >> > languages.
>> >> > And my wife has a new HP with Vista. After reading the messages and
>> >> > pleas
>> >> > for help in this newsgroup and others, if anyone will be honest
>> >> > enough,
>> >> > they will agree that Vista has gone overboard with security. Vista
>> >> > has
>> >> > sucked ALL the FUN out of computing. I surf the web all the time and
>> >> > with
>> >> > a
>> >> > few precautions, I have never had any problems from hackers. Long
>> >> > story
>> >> > short...I HOPE VISTA FAILS AND IS NOT ACCEPTED BY THE PUBLIC. From
>> >> > reading
>> >> > this newsgroup and others, there are many, many dissatisfied
>> >> > customers.
>> >> > When my ME and XP computers can no longer be repaired, if Vista is
>> >> > all
>> >> > that
>> >> > is available, I will NEVER get on a computer again.
>> >> > Paul
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >>
>>

Well its only a matter of time before the Secure Desktop feature will be
bypassed, and this thread is about Vista taking the FUN ou of computing which
UAC does.

"Ronnie Vernon MVP" wrote:

> JD
>
> Without the secure desktop, the UAC prompt would be meaningless since any
> malware could easily spoof the UAC prompt. The secure desktop backs up the
> UAC prompt by making it impossible for any action to take place until the
> user gives their permission.
>
> When you have a few minutes to spare, check the following link. This gives a
> very good description of how different operating systems implement this
> process.
>
> Comparison of privilege authorization features:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compari...ation_features
>
>
> --
>
> Ronnie Vernon
> Microsoft MVP
> Windows Shell/User
>
>
> "JD" <JD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:FCB76147-E9E2-447D-91C8-B72ADA633A60@microsoft.com...
> > Ronnie
> >
> > Doesn't change the fact that it is poorly executed and annoying, why not
> > just the dialog but give it an "always on top feature" like Task Manager,
> > means it can'y be ignored but is less obtrusive than the dim screen, whats
> > a
> > novice gonna think when they see that?
> >
> > "Ronnie Vernon MVP" wrote:
> >
> >> JD
> >>
> >> UAC has 2 separate components. One is the displayed dialog asking for
> >> permission and the other is the Secure Destop (The dimmed screen) which
> >> prevents anything from running until you OK the requested action.
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Ronnie Vernon
> >> Microsoft MVP
> >> Windows Shell/User
> >>
> >>
> >> "JD" <JD@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> >> news:AE4687FE-7D58-4686-A1DA-2EDD8C6E7FD3@microsoft.com...
> >> >I think that Vista is fun to use, although UAC is a bit overboard in its
> >> > execution, with the whole black out the screen when a a discreet
> >> > dialogue
> >> > would have done, I for one can't stand it, but thats my opinion.
> >> > Also on what many people feel as removing fun is the wee bugs here and
> >> > there
> >> > e.g.Open Reliability and Performance Monitor, go to View>Customize,
> >> > then
> >> > try
> >> > and X out of the dialgoue, does nothing, but wee niggles will improve
> >> > with
> >> > time and it will be as good in a few years as XP is today.
> >> >
> >> > "Dustin Harper" wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> I enjoy Vista, and think it is fun. A lot of people don't like XP at
> >> >> all,
> >> >> and go with 98 or 2000. That's their opinion. But, if your only source
> >> >> of
> >> >> information is reading about other peoples problems, I agree with
> >> >> Ronnie
> >> >> Vernon. You can't get an overall picture of satisfaction by looking at
> >> >> the
> >> >> bad part of town. Not too many people go out of their ways to say
> >> >> positive
> >> >> things in here.
> >> >>
> >> >> And your last statement "When my ME and XP computers can no longer be
> >> >> repaired...", got me confused. ME is fun?
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> Dustin Harper
> >> >> dharper@vistarip.com
> >> >> http://www.vistarip.com
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> "Paul" <Paul@SBCmetro.com> wrote in message
> >> >> news:ix0%h.575$LR5.512@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
> >> >> >I have been using computers ever since they came out (It was my job).
> >> >> >I
> >> >> >have
> >> >> > built, repaired, and modified computers. I can program in several
> >> >> > languages.
> >> >> > And my wife has a new HP with Vista. After reading the messages and
> >> >> > pleas
> >> >> > for help in this newsgroup and others, if anyone will be honest
> >> >> > enough,
> >> >> > they will agree that Vista has gone overboard with security. Vista
> >> >> > has
> >> >> > sucked ALL the FUN out of computing. I surf the web all the time and
> >> >> > with
> >> >> > a
> >> >> > few precautions, I have never had any problems from hackers. Long
> >> >> > story
> >> >> > short...I HOPE VISTA FAILS AND IS NOT ACCEPTED BY THE PUBLIC. From
> >> >> > reading
> >> >> > this newsgroup and others, there are many, many dissatisfied
> >> >> > customers.
> >> >> > When my ME and XP computers can no longer be repaired, if Vista is
> >> >> > all
> >> >> > that
> >> >> > is available, I will NEVER get on a computer again.
> >> >> > Paul
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >>
>

"Paul" <Paul@SBCmetro.com> wrote in message
news:ix0%h.575$LR5.512@newssvr17.news.prodigy.net...
>I have been using computers ever since they came out (It was my job). I
>have
> built, repaired, and modified computers. I can program in several
> languages.
> And my wife has a new HP with Vista. After reading the messages and pleas
> for help in this newsgroup and others, if anyone will be honest enough,
> they will agree that Vista has gone overboard with security. Vista has
> sucked ALL the FUN out of computing. I surf the web all the time and with
> a
> few precautions, I have never had any problems from hackers. Long story
> short...I HOPE VISTA FAILS AND IS NOT ACCEPTED BY THE PUBLIC. From reading
> this newsgroup and others, there are many, many dissatisfied customers.
> When my ME and XP computers can no longer be repaired, if Vista is all
> that
> is available, I will NEVER get on a computer again.
> Paul
>
>


By and large, I'd have to agree with you, although I suspect the real
problem is, MS shipped an immature
project, probably just not enough testing on a near-golden release
candidate, but that's just speculation. There's not much chance of getting
satisfaction from MS in a MS sponsored forum, however.

My own beef with Vista has boiled down to some (re-)indexing issues, and a
problem with User Account profiles that is consistently worked around by
rebooting.

You'd think any problem so regular that a) it ALWAYS occurs, and b) the
workaround ALWAYS works, could be fixed. I'm sure it will be eventually.

Meanwhile, there's always Ubuntu, which DOES run on this notebook even with
nVidia's proprietary graphics drivers. Evolution and Open Office is all I
really need -- the rest (and it's a large "rest" I'll grant you) is just fun
stuff. It's ironic that the world's best programs have been written to run
under Windows.