Vista - Vista Experience

10-11-2008

As many readers may not have "upgraded" to Vista yet, I thought that I'd log
some perspectives.

FWIW, I have used scores of operating systems over the past forty years -
including Digital's VMS from which WNT (the forerunner of XP and presumably
Vista) was "lifted". For those who are not aware, V+1, M+1, S+1 = WNT =
Windows NT. (Microsoft's well-documented equivalent of the HAL/IBM pun.)

Observations:
1. Vista is very pretty. Far prettier than XP. If you like pretty, Vista
is for you.
2. Windows Mail is truly awful. After importing my ONE mail when I upgraded,
WM decided to drop all the "Account" data fields in the import. It was
quite happy to include this column for mail I received subsequently, but as
I have 8 mail accounts and imported over 2,000 important emails, the loss of
into which accounts each of the previous emails came was a surprise for me.
Of course I am now stuck with it. I also used the "Outlook Bar" extensively.
Not permitted in WM though - Microsoft removed this capability.
3. Windows Mail "Junk E-mail" filtering has the intelligence of a
three-year-old. (No offence intended to three-year-olds.) I am still
telling it what is junk and what is not junk after seven weeks of training.
Even Norton's Anti-Spam took only a few days of training to get 95%
correctly sorted. If Microsoft wants to serve its customers, they should
provide Norton (and others) whatever is needed so that these other companies
can apply their far superior methods for those of us who need intelligent
spam filtering in Windows Mail.
4. Vista freezes and gets itself confused much more than XP. It's like
going back to Windows Me. It is years since I have had to restart Windows
so often.
5. User Account Control is a real pain. For a single-user home system, its
paternalism is the most intrusive idiocy that I have ever encountered. Its
like walking around one's home with a little voice saying "do you really
mean to do this?" every time you do anything. It's enough to make one
consider leaving home.
6. So many features have been removed. I used to press the "sleep" button
on my keyboard to turn the system off. Vista won't let me assign power-down
to a sleep button. I guess Microsoft think I might get confused?
7. And so on... Removed features, inferior performance, little progress towards a good operating system. (It is truly amazing how many third-party utilities one has to purchase in order to get a decent "operating system" environment.)

Microsoft, forget Windows 7 for now. My mother taught me to finish what was
on my plate before I could even think about afters. You certainly have a
lot of work to do to finish what is on your Vista plate. Get to work,
forget prettiness for a year or so, and get Vista SP2, SP3, etc. released
asap.

Nigel

10-12-2008

Try Windows Live Mail instead. You will like it.
Is yours an OEM install? If so remove trialware and crapware. It solves
most issues.
Windows 7 is being built on Vista; so in a sense it is expected to
address most Vista disapointments.

--
HappyAndyK

www.WinVistaClub.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------
HappyAndyK's Profile: http://winvistaclub.com/forum/member.php?userid=4
View this thread: http://winvistaclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24032

10-12-2008

"HappyAndyK" <HappyAndyK.3h5pqo@xxxxxx> wrote in message
news:HappyAndyK.3h5pqo@xxxxxx

Quote:

>
> Try Windows Live Mail instead. You will like it.
> Is yours an OEM install? If so remove trialware and crapware. It solves
> most issues.
> Windows 7 is being built on Vista; so in a sense it is expected to address
> most Vista disapointments.

> --
> HappyAndyK

Of course, and MS will want the price of an upgrade for what will
essentially be a major service pack.
I haven't been happy with Vista since the first BETA build; and I was fairly
vocal saying so.
But MS doesn't care what customers actualy want; they want to put out what
their marketing people tell them people want.
They may be several thousand miles off the mark, but that is what they
believe is desired.
I just wonder where they get the people they use in these focus groups?
Maybe they use former members of OJ's original jury?

10-12-2008

"Nigel Bufton" <nigel@xxxxxx> wrote in message
news:eTGQcdDLJHA.1500@xxxxxx

Quote:

> As many readers may not have "upgraded" to Vista yet, I thought that I'd
> log
> some perspectives.

Quote:

> FWIW, I have used scores of operating systems over the past forty years -
> including Digital's VMS from which WNT (the forerunner of XP and
> presumably
> Vista) was "lifted". For those who are not aware, V+1, M+1, S+1 = WNT =
> Windows NT. (Microsoft's well-documented equivalent of the HAL/IBM pun.)

But obviously new to Usenet. Do NOT post to Usenet in HTML. Usenet is a
TEXT-based system.

Quote:

> Observations:
> 1. Vista is very pretty. Far prettier than XP. If you like pretty, Vista
> is for you.

Just set it to Windows Classic.......

Quote:

> 2. Windows Mail is truly awful. After importing my ONE mail when I
> upgraded,
> WM decided to drop all the "Account" data fields in the import. It was
> quite happy to include this column for mail I received subsequently, but
> as
> I have 8 mail accounts and imported over 2,000 important emails, the loss
> of
> into which accounts each of the previous emails came was a surprise for
> me.
> Of course I am now stuck with it. I also used the "Outlook Bar"
> extensively.
> Not permitted in WM though - Microsoft removed this capability.

"Outlook bar"? What's that? Never heard of it. And of COURSE you're not
"stuck" with it. There are planty of free replacements out there.
Thunderbird and Windows Live Mail to name two.

Quote:

> 3. Windows Mail "Junk E-mail" filtering has the intelligence of a
> three-year-old. (No offence intended to three-year-olds.) I am still
> telling it what is junk and what is not junk after seven weeks of
> training.
> Even Norton's Anti-Spam took only a few days of training to get 95%
> correctly sorted. If Microsoft wants to serve its customers, they should
> provide Norton (and others) whatever is needed so that these other
> companies
> can apply their far superior methods for those of us who need intelligent
> spam filtering in Windows Mail.

If you get that much junk email yhen you are doing something very wrong - I
assume the email address you used to post this mis your real address? Then
get ready for LOADS more spam.

Quote:

> 4. Vista freezes and gets itself confused much more than XP. It's like
> going back to Windows Me. It is years since I have had to restart Windows
> so often.

Then presumably your machine is not up to the job. My machine hasn't
"frozen" once in the six months I've had it...

Quote:

> 5. User Account Control is a real pain. For a single-user home system,
> its
> paternalism is the most intrusive idiocy that I have ever encountered.
> Its
> like walking around one's home with a little voice saying "do you really
> mean to do this?" every time you do anything. It's enough to make one
> consider leaving home.

<sigh> all the REALLY secure Operating Systems have some sort of UAC. Unix,
Linux etc etc. The fact that you have a "single-user home system" is totally
beside the point. The point, and if your OS experience is as good as you say
it is it doesn't show, is to prevent unauthorised access to system areas by
things like malware and viruses.
Besides unless you are CONSTANTLY tinkering with your OS rather than doing
work with it, the UAC only happens rarely. Mine comes up only on my weekly
Adaware scan. that's all.

Quote:

> 6. So many features have been removed. I used to press the "sleep" button
> on my keyboard to turn the system off. Vista won't let me assign
> power-down
> to a sleep button. I guess Microsoft think I might get confused?

How about Start-Sleep with your mouse? (It takes all of errr 0.5 seconds
longer than pressing a key....)

Quote:

> 7. And so on... Removed features, inferior performance, little progress
> towards a good operating system. (It is truly amazing how many
> third-party utilities one has to purchase in order to > get a decent
> "operating system" environment.)

It's truly amazing that I have purchased NO third-party utilities to get a
good stable working environment.

10-12-2008

You feel better now Nigel.

Just my 2 cents. Everything that you describe as not working or missing or whatever on your Vista install is most likely user induced since those do not happen at this end

--
Peter

Please Reply to Newsgroup for the benefit of others
Requests for assistance by email can not and will not be acknowledged.

"Nigel Bufton" <nigel@xxxxxx> wrote in message news:eTGQcdDLJHA.1500@xxxxxx
As many readers may not have "upgraded" to Vista yet, I thought that I'd log
some perspectives.

FWIW, I have used scores of operating systems over the past forty years -
including Digital's VMS from which WNT (the forerunner of XP and presumably
Vista) was "lifted". For those who are not aware, V+1, M+1, S+1 = WNT =
Windows NT. (Microsoft's well-documented equivalent of the HAL/IBM pun.)

Observations:
1. Vista is very pretty. Far prettier than XP. If you like pretty, Vista
is for you.
2. Windows Mail is truly awful. After importing my ONE mail when I upgraded,
WM decided to drop all the "Account" data fields in the import. It was
quite happy to include this column for mail I received subsequently, but as
I have 8 mail accounts and imported over 2,000 important emails, the loss of
into which accounts each of the previous emails came was a surprise for me.
Of course I am now stuck with it. I also used the "Outlook Bar" extensively.
Not permitted in WM though - Microsoft removed this capability.
3. Windows Mail "Junk E-mail" filtering has the intelligence of a
three-year-old. (No offence intended to three-year-olds.) I am still
telling it what is junk and what is not junk after seven weeks of training.
Even Norton's Anti-Spam took only a few days of training to get 95%
correctly sorted. If Microsoft wants to serve its customers, they should
provide Norton (and others) whatever is needed so that these other companies
can apply their far superior methods for those of us who need intelligent
spam filtering in Windows Mail.
4. Vista freezes and gets itself confused much more than XP. It's like
going back to Windows Me. It is years since I have had to restart Windows
so often.
5. User Account Control is a real pain. For a single-user home system, its
paternalism is the most intrusive idiocy that I have ever encountered. Its
like walking around one's home with a little voice saying "do you really
mean to do this?" every time you do anything. It's enough to make one
consider leaving home.
6. So many features have been removed. I used to press the "sleep" button
on my keyboard to turn the system off. Vista won't let me assign power-down
to a sleep button. I guess Microsoft think I might get confused?
7. And so on... Removed features, inferior performance, little progress towards a good operating system. (It is truly amazing how many third-party utilities one has to purchase in order to get a decent "operating system" environment.)

Microsoft, forget Windows 7 for now. My mother taught me to finish what was
on my plate before I could even think about afters. You certainly have a
lot of work to do to finish what is on your Vista plate. Get to work,
forget prettiness for a year or so, and get Vista SP2, SP3, etc. released
asap.

Nigel

10-12-2008

"Gordon" <gordonbparker@xxxxxx> wrote in message news:eEgY2FFLJHA.5692@xxxxxx

Quote:

> "Nigel Bufton" <nigel@xxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:eTGQcdDLJHA.1500@xxxxxx

Quote:

>> As many readers may not have "upgraded" to Vista yet, I thought that I'd
>> log
>> some perspectives.

>

Quote:

>> FWIW, I have used scores of operating systems over the past forty years -
>> including Digital's VMS from which WNT (the forerunner of XP and
>> presumably
>> Vista) was "lifted". For those who are not aware, V+1, M+1, S+1 = WNT =
>> Windows NT. (Microsoft's well-documented equivalent of the HAL/IBM pun.)

>
> But obviously new to Usenet. Do NOT post to Usenet in HTML. Usenet is a
> TEXT-based system.
>

Quote:

>> Observations:
>> 1. Vista is very pretty. Far prettier than XP. If you like pretty, Vista
>> is for you.

>
> Just set it to Windows Classic.......
>

Quote:

>> 2. Windows Mail is truly awful. After importing my ONE mail when I
>> upgraded,
>> WM decided to drop all the "Account" data fields in the import. It was
>> quite happy to include this column for mail I received subsequently, but
>> as
>> I have 8 mail accounts and imported over 2,000 important emails, the loss
>> of
>> into which accounts each of the previous emails came was a surprise for
>> me.
>> Of course I am now stuck with it. I also used the "Outlook Bar"
>> extensively.
>> Not permitted in WM though - Microsoft removed this capability.

>
> "Outlook bar"? What's that? Never heard of it. And of COURSE you're not
> "stuck" with it. There are planty of free replacements out there.
> Thunderbird and Windows Live Mail to name two.
>

Quote:

>> 3. Windows Mail "Junk E-mail" filtering has the intelligence of a
>> three-year-old. (No offence intended to three-year-olds.) I am still
>> telling it what is junk and what is not junk after seven weeks of
>> training.
>> Even Norton's Anti-Spam took only a few days of training to get 95%
>> correctly sorted. If Microsoft wants to serve its customers, they should
>> provide Norton (and others) whatever is needed so that these other
>> companies
>> can apply their far superior methods for those of us who need intelligent
>> spam filtering in Windows Mail.

>
> If you get that much junk email yhen you are doing something very wrong - I
> assume the email address you used to post this mis your real address? Then
> get ready for LOADS more spam.
>

Quote:

>> 4. Vista freezes and gets itself confused much more than XP. It's like
>> going back to Windows Me. It is years since I have had to restart Windows
>> so often.

>
> Then presumably your machine is not up to the job. My machine hasn't
> "frozen" once in the six months I've had it...
>

Quote:

>> 5. User Account Control is a real pain. For a single-user home system,
>> its
>> paternalism is the most intrusive idiocy that I have ever encountered.
>> Its
>> like walking around one's home with a little voice saying "do you really
>> mean to do this?" every time you do anything. It's enough to make one
>> consider leaving home.

>
> <sigh> all the REALLY secure Operating Systems have some sort of UAC. Unix,
> Linux etc etc. The fact that you have a "single-user home system" is totally
> beside the point. The point, and if your OS experience is as good as you say
> it is it doesn't show, is to prevent unauthorised access to system areas by
> things like malware and viruses.
> Besides unless you are CONSTANTLY tinkering with your OS rather than doing
> work with it, the UAC only happens rarely. Mine comes up only on my weekly
> Adaware scan. that's all.
>

Quote:

>> 6. So many features have been removed. I used to press the "sleep" button
>> on my keyboard to turn the system off. Vista won't let me assign
>> power-down
>> to a sleep button. I guess Microsoft think I might get confused?

>
> How about Start-Sleep with your mouse? (It takes all of errr 0.5 seconds
> longer than pressing a key....)
>
>

Quote:

>> 7. And so on... Removed features, inferior performance, little progress
>> towards a good operating system. (It is truly amazing how many
>> third-party utilities one has to purchase in order to > get a decent
>> "operating system" environment.)

>
> It's truly amazing that I have purchased NO third-party utilities to get a
> good stable working environment.
>
>
>
>

I too have experience with many operating systems going back to the Commodore 64, Commodore Amiga 500 and 2000 and started with WFWG 3.1 on my first Windows pc.

I have had a very positive experience with Vista now on 4 different PC's of my own.

--

Little Charlie
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page...?bandID=861653
"Destroy your EGO and your ART will flourish"

10-12-2008

The last resort of the inept and confused is to blame the Operating System.
--
oscar

....Right click is your very good friend...

"Nigel Bufton" wrote:

Quote:

> As many readers may not have "upgraded" to Vista yet, I thought that I'd log
> some perspectives.
>
> FWIW, I have used scores of operating systems over the past forty years -
> including Digital's VMS from which WNT (the forerunner of XP and presumably
> Vista) was "lifted". For those who are not aware, V+1, M+1, S+1 = WNT =
> Windows NT. (Microsoft's well-documented equivalent of the HAL/IBM pun.)
>
> Observations:
> 1. Vista is very pretty. Far prettier than XP. If you like pretty, Vista
> is for you.
> 2. Windows Mail is truly awful. After importing my ONE mail when I upgraded,
> WM decided to drop all the "Account" data fields in the import. It was
> quite happy to include this column for mail I received subsequently, but as
> I have 8 mail accounts and imported over 2,000 important emails, the loss of
> into which accounts each of the previous emails came was a surprise for me.
> Of course I am now stuck with it. I also used the "Outlook Bar" extensively.
> Not permitted in WM though - Microsoft removed this capability.
> 3. Windows Mail "Junk E-mail" filtering has the intelligence of a
> three-year-old. (No offence intended to three-year-olds.) I am still
> telling it what is junk and what is not junk after seven weeks of training.
> Even Norton's Anti-Spam took only a few days of training to get 95%
> correctly sorted. If Microsoft wants to serve its customers, they should
> provide Norton (and others) whatever is needed so that these other companies
> can apply their far superior methods for those of us who need intelligent
> spam filtering in Windows Mail.
> 4. Vista freezes and gets itself confused much more than XP. It's like
> going back to Windows Me. It is years since I have had to restart Windows
> so often.
> 5. User Account Control is a real pain. For a single-user home system, its
> paternalism is the most intrusive idiocy that I have ever encountered. Its
> like walking around one's home with a little voice saying "do you really
> mean to do this?" every time you do anything. It's enough to make one
> consider leaving home.
> 6. So many features have been removed. I used to press the "sleep" button
> on my keyboard to turn the system off. Vista won't let me assign power-down
> to a sleep button. I guess Microsoft think I might get confused?
> 7. And so on... Removed features, inferior performance, little progress towards a good operating system. (It is truly amazing how many third-party utilities one has to purchase in order to get a decent "operating system" environment.)
>
> Microsoft, forget Windows 7 for now. My mother taught me to finish what was
> on my plate before I could even think about afters. You certainly have a
> lot of work to do to finish what is on your Vista plate. Get to work,
> forget prettiness for a year or so, and get Vista SP2, SP3, etc. released
> asap.
>
> Nigel
>
>
>
>
>
>

10-12-2008

On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 12:47:13 +0530, HappyAndyK
<HappyAndyK.3h5pqo@xxxxxx> wrote:

Quote:

>Try Windows Live Mail instead. You will like it.

No he won't. He has 8 mail accounts. With Windows Live Mail, he gets 8
Inbox's, 8 Sent Folders, 8 Draft Folders. Windows Live Mail is
marginal for anyone with more than one email account, it sucks for
anyone with "many" email accounts.

Quote:

>Is yours an OEM install? If so remove trialware and crapware. It solves
>most issues.

So a new install is supposed to fix the major bugs in Vista
Networking? It's supposed to fix that fact that Vista is a bloated pig
and runs twice as slow as XP?

Quote:

>Windows 7 is being built on Vista; so in a sense it is expected to
>address most Vista disapointments.

Or, more likely, it will have all the same disappointments - once more
rearranged, dumbed down some more, and even more bugs as MS once again
rewrites the OS instead of fixing the old one.

10-12-2008

On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 20:45:55 -0400, +Bob+ <uctraing@xxxxxx>
wrote:

Quote:

> On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 12:47:13 +0530, HappyAndyK
> <HappyAndyK.3h5pqo@xxxxxx> wrote:
>

Quote:

> >Try Windows Live Mail instead. You will like it.

>
> No he won't. He has 8 mail accounts. With Windows Live Mail, he gets 8
> Inbox's, 8 Sent Folders, 8 Draft Folders.

I've never used Windows Live Mail, and know next to nothing about it.
What you state above is one of the things I didn't know, so I thank
you for posting that information. It would certainly turn me off.

Quote:

> Windows Live Mail is
> marginal for anyone with more than one email account, it sucks for
> anyone with "many" email accounts.
>

Quote:

> >Is yours an OEM install? If so remove trialware and crapware. It solves
> >most issues.

>
> So a new install is supposed to fix the major bugs in Vista
> Networking? It's supposed to fix that fact that Vista is a bloated pig
> and runs twice as slow as XP?
>

Quote:

> >Windows 7 is being built on Vista; so in a sense it is expected to
> >address most Vista disapointments.

>
> Or, more likely, it will have all the same disappointments - once more
> rearranged, dumbed down some more, and even more bugs as MS once again
> rewrites the OS instead of fixing the old one.
>
>

--
Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP - Windows Desktop Experience
Please Reply to the Newsgroup

10-13-2008

On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:51:07 -0700, "Ken Blake, MVP"
<kblake@xxxxxx> wrote:

Quote:

>
>I've never used Windows Live Mail, and know next to nothing about it.
>What you state above is one of the things I didn't know, so I thank
>you for posting that information. It would certainly turn me off.
>

FWIW - MS missed the boat on WLMail and multiple accounts - which is
disappointing, since they tout it as the product for people with
multiple accounts. They force you to have separate folders. T-bird
allows you to CHOSE to have separate folders on a per account basis or
to share as you see fit. I ended up with T-bird as the only product
that would run on multiple MS OS's and handle my dozen email accounts.

10-11-2008	#1 (permalink)
Nigel Bufton n/a posts	Vista Experience As many readers may not have "upgraded" to Vista yet, I thought that I'd log some perspectives. FWIW, I have used scores of operating systems over the past forty years - including Digital's VMS from which WNT (the forerunner of XP and presumably Vista) was "lifted". For those who are not aware, V+1, M+1, S+1 = WNT = Windows NT. (Microsoft's well-documented equivalent of the HAL/IBM pun.) Observations: 1. Vista is very pretty. Far prettier than XP. If you like pretty, Vista is for you. 2. Windows Mail is truly awful. After importing my ONE mail when I upgraded, WM decided to drop all the "Account" data fields in the import. It was quite happy to include this column for mail I received subsequently, but as I have 8 mail accounts and imported over 2,000 important emails, the loss of into which accounts each of the previous emails came was a surprise for me. Of course I am now stuck with it. I also used the "Outlook Bar" extensively. Not permitted in WM though - Microsoft removed this capability. 3. Windows Mail "Junk E-mail" filtering has the intelligence of a three-year-old. (No offence intended to three-year-olds.) I am still telling it what is junk and what is not junk after seven weeks of training. Even Norton's Anti-Spam took only a few days of training to get 95% correctly sorted. If Microsoft wants to serve its customers, they should provide Norton (and others) whatever is needed so that these other companies can apply their far superior methods for those of us who need intelligent spam filtering in Windows Mail. 4. Vista freezes and gets itself confused much more than XP. It's like going back to Windows Me. It is years since I have had to restart Windows so often. 5. User Account Control is a real pain. For a single-user home system, its paternalism is the most intrusive idiocy that I have ever encountered. Its like walking around one's home with a little voice saying "do you really mean to do this?" every time you do anything. It's enough to make one consider leaving home. 6. So many features have been removed. I used to press the "sleep" button on my keyboard to turn the system off. Vista won't let me assign power-down to a sleep button. I guess Microsoft think I might get confused? 7. And so on... Removed features, inferior performance, little progress towards a good operating system. (It is truly amazing how many third-party utilities one has to purchase in order to get a decent "operating system" environment.) Microsoft, forget Windows 7 for now. My mother taught me to finish what was on my plate before I could even think about afters. You certainly have a lot of work to do to finish what is on your Vista plate. Get to work, forget prettiness for a year or so, and get Vista SP2, SP3, etc. released asap. Nigel
My System Specs

10-12-2008	#2 (permalink)
HappyAndyK n/a posts	Re: Vista Experience Try Windows Live Mail instead. You will like it. Is yours an OEM install? If so remove trialware and crapware. It solves most issues. Windows 7 is being built on Vista; so in a sense it is expected to address most Vista disapointments. -- HappyAndyK www.WinVistaClub.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------ HappyAndyK's Profile: http://winvistaclub.com/forum/member.php?userid=4 View this thread: http://winvistaclub.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24032
My System Specs

10-12-2008	#3 (permalink)
Not Even Me n/a posts	Re: Vista Experience "HappyAndyK" <HappyAndyK.3h5pqo@xxxxxx> wrote in message news:HappyAndyK.3h5pqo@xxxxxx Quote: > > Try Windows Live Mail instead. You will like it. > Is yours an OEM install? If so remove trialware and crapware. It solves > most issues. > Windows 7 is being built on Vista; so in a sense it is expected to address > most Vista disapointments. > -- > HappyAndyK Of course, and MS will want the price of an upgrade for what will essentially be a major service pack. I haven't been happy with Vista since the first BETA build; and I was fairly vocal saying so. But MS doesn't care what customers actualy want; they want to put out what their marketing people tell them people want. They may be several thousand miles off the mark, but that is what they believe is desired. I just wonder where they get the people they use in these focus groups? Maybe they use former members of OJ's original jury?
My System Specs

10-12-2008	#4 (permalink)
Gordon n/a posts	Re: Vista Experience "Nigel Bufton" <nigel@xxxxxx> wrote in message news:eTGQcdDLJHA.1500@xxxxxx Quote: > As many readers may not have "upgraded" to Vista yet, I thought that I'd > log > some perspectives. Quote: > FWIW, I have used scores of operating systems over the past forty years - > including Digital's VMS from which WNT (the forerunner of XP and > presumably > Vista) was "lifted". For those who are not aware, V+1, M+1, S+1 = WNT = > Windows NT. (Microsoft's well-documented equivalent of the HAL/IBM pun.) But obviously new to Usenet. Do NOT post to Usenet in HTML. Usenet is a TEXT-based system. Quote: > Observations: > 1. Vista is very pretty. Far prettier than XP. If you like pretty, Vista > is for you. Just set it to Windows Classic....... Quote: > 2. Windows Mail is truly awful. After importing my ONE mail when I > upgraded, > WM decided to drop all the "Account" data fields in the import. It was > quite happy to include this column for mail I received subsequently, but > as > I have 8 mail accounts and imported over 2,000 important emails, the loss > of > into which accounts each of the previous emails came was a surprise for > me. > Of course I am now stuck with it. I also used the "Outlook Bar" > extensively. > Not permitted in WM though - Microsoft removed this capability. "Outlook bar"? What's that? Never heard of it. And of COURSE you're not "stuck" with it. There are planty of free replacements out there. Thunderbird and Windows Live Mail to name two. Quote: > 3. Windows Mail "Junk E-mail" filtering has the intelligence of a > three-year-old. (No offence intended to three-year-olds.) I am still > telling it what is junk and what is not junk after seven weeks of > training. > Even Norton's Anti-Spam took only a few days of training to get 95% > correctly sorted. If Microsoft wants to serve its customers, they should > provide Norton (and others) whatever is needed so that these other > companies > can apply their far superior methods for those of us who need intelligent > spam filtering in Windows Mail. If you get that much junk email yhen you are doing something very wrong - I assume the email address you used to post this mis your real address? Then get ready for LOADS more spam. Quote: > 4. Vista freezes and gets itself confused much more than XP. It's like > going back to Windows Me. It is years since I have had to restart Windows > so often. Then presumably your machine is not up to the job. My machine hasn't "frozen" once in the six months I've had it... Quote: > 5. User Account Control is a real pain. For a single-user home system, > its > paternalism is the most intrusive idiocy that I have ever encountered. > Its > like walking around one's home with a little voice saying "do you really > mean to do this?" every time you do anything. It's enough to make one > consider leaving home. <sigh> all the REALLY secure Operating Systems have some sort of UAC. Unix, Linux etc etc. The fact that you have a "single-user home system" is totally beside the point. The point, and if your OS experience is as good as you say it is it doesn't show, is to prevent unauthorised access to system areas by things like malware and viruses. Besides unless you are CONSTANTLY tinkering with your OS rather than doing work with it, the UAC only happens rarely. Mine comes up only on my weekly Adaware scan. that's all. Quote: > 6. So many features have been removed. I used to press the "sleep" button > on my keyboard to turn the system off. Vista won't let me assign > power-down > to a sleep button. I guess Microsoft think I might get confused? How about Start-Sleep with your mouse? (It takes all of errr 0.5 seconds longer than pressing a key....) Quote: > 7. And so on... Removed features, inferior performance, little progress > towards a good operating system. (It is truly amazing how many > third-party utilities one has to purchase in order to > get a decent > "operating system" environment.) It's truly amazing that I have purchased NO third-party utilities to get a good stable working environment.
My System Specs

10-12-2008	#5 (permalink)
Peter Foldes n/a posts	Re: Vista Experience You feel better now Nigel. Just my 2 cents. Everything that you describe as not working or missing or whatever on your Vista install is most likely user induced since those do not happen at this end -- Peter Please Reply to Newsgroup for the benefit of others Requests for assistance by email can not and will not be acknowledged. "Nigel Bufton" <nigel@xxxxxx> wrote in message news:eTGQcdDLJHA.1500@xxxxxx As many readers may not have "upgraded" to Vista yet, I thought that I'd log some perspectives. FWIW, I have used scores of operating systems over the past forty years - including Digital's VMS from which WNT (the forerunner of XP and presumably Vista) was "lifted". For those who are not aware, V+1, M+1, S+1 = WNT = Windows NT. (Microsoft's well-documented equivalent of the HAL/IBM pun.) Observations: 1. Vista is very pretty. Far prettier than XP. If you like pretty, Vista is for you. 2. Windows Mail is truly awful. After importing my ONE mail when I upgraded, WM decided to drop all the "Account" data fields in the import. It was quite happy to include this column for mail I received subsequently, but as I have 8 mail accounts and imported over 2,000 important emails, the loss of into which accounts each of the previous emails came was a surprise for me. Of course I am now stuck with it. I also used the "Outlook Bar" extensively. Not permitted in WM though - Microsoft removed this capability. 3. Windows Mail "Junk E-mail" filtering has the intelligence of a three-year-old. (No offence intended to three-year-olds.) I am still telling it what is junk and what is not junk after seven weeks of training. Even Norton's Anti-Spam took only a few days of training to get 95% correctly sorted. If Microsoft wants to serve its customers, they should provide Norton (and others) whatever is needed so that these other companies can apply their far superior methods for those of us who need intelligent spam filtering in Windows Mail. 4. Vista freezes and gets itself confused much more than XP. It's like going back to Windows Me. It is years since I have had to restart Windows so often. 5. User Account Control is a real pain. For a single-user home system, its paternalism is the most intrusive idiocy that I have ever encountered. Its like walking around one's home with a little voice saying "do you really mean to do this?" every time you do anything. It's enough to make one consider leaving home. 6. So many features have been removed. I used to press the "sleep" button on my keyboard to turn the system off. Vista won't let me assign power-down to a sleep button. I guess Microsoft think I might get confused? 7. And so on... Removed features, inferior performance, little progress towards a good operating system. (It is truly amazing how many third-party utilities one has to purchase in order to get a decent "operating system" environment.) Microsoft, forget Windows 7 for now. My mother taught me to finish what was on my plate before I could even think about afters. You certainly have a lot of work to do to finish what is on your Vista plate. Get to work, forget prettiness for a year or so, and get Vista SP2, SP3, etc. released asap. Nigel
My System Specs

10-12-2008	#6 (permalink)
Little Charlie n/a posts	Re: Vista Experience "Gordon" <gordonbparker@xxxxxx> wrote in message news:eEgY2FFLJHA.5692@xxxxxx Quote: > "Nigel Bufton" <nigel@xxxxxx> wrote in message > news:eTGQcdDLJHA.1500@xxxxxx Quote: >> As many readers may not have "upgraded" to Vista yet, I thought that I'd >> log >> some perspectives. > Quote: >> FWIW, I have used scores of operating systems over the past forty years - >> including Digital's VMS from which WNT (the forerunner of XP and >> presumably >> Vista) was "lifted". For those who are not aware, V+1, M+1, S+1 = WNT = >> Windows NT. (Microsoft's well-documented equivalent of the HAL/IBM pun.) > > But obviously new to Usenet. Do NOT post to Usenet in HTML. Usenet is a > TEXT-based system. > Quote: >> Observations: >> 1. Vista is very pretty. Far prettier than XP. If you like pretty, Vista >> is for you. > > Just set it to Windows Classic....... > Quote: >> 2. Windows Mail is truly awful. After importing my ONE mail when I >> upgraded, >> WM decided to drop all the "Account" data fields in the import. It was >> quite happy to include this column for mail I received subsequently, but >> as >> I have 8 mail accounts and imported over 2,000 important emails, the loss >> of >> into which accounts each of the previous emails came was a surprise for >> me. >> Of course I am now stuck with it. I also used the "Outlook Bar" >> extensively. >> Not permitted in WM though - Microsoft removed this capability. > > "Outlook bar"? What's that? Never heard of it. And of COURSE you're not > "stuck" with it. There are planty of free replacements out there. > Thunderbird and Windows Live Mail to name two. > Quote: >> 3. Windows Mail "Junk E-mail" filtering has the intelligence of a >> three-year-old. (No offence intended to three-year-olds.) I am still >> telling it what is junk and what is not junk after seven weeks of >> training. >> Even Norton's Anti-Spam took only a few days of training to get 95% >> correctly sorted. If Microsoft wants to serve its customers, they should >> provide Norton (and others) whatever is needed so that these other >> companies >> can apply their far superior methods for those of us who need intelligent >> spam filtering in Windows Mail. > > If you get that much junk email yhen you are doing something very wrong - I > assume the email address you used to post this mis your real address? Then > get ready for LOADS more spam. > Quote: >> 4. Vista freezes and gets itself confused much more than XP. It's like >> going back to Windows Me. It is years since I have had to restart Windows >> so often. > > Then presumably your machine is not up to the job. My machine hasn't > "frozen" once in the six months I've had it... > Quote: >> 5. User Account Control is a real pain. For a single-user home system, >> its >> paternalism is the most intrusive idiocy that I have ever encountered. >> Its >> like walking around one's home with a little voice saying "do you really >> mean to do this?" every time you do anything. It's enough to make one >> consider leaving home. > > <sigh> all the REALLY secure Operating Systems have some sort of UAC. Unix, > Linux etc etc. The fact that you have a "single-user home system" is totally > beside the point. The point, and if your OS experience is as good as you say > it is it doesn't show, is to prevent unauthorised access to system areas by > things like malware and viruses. > Besides unless you are CONSTANTLY tinkering with your OS rather than doing > work with it, the UAC only happens rarely. Mine comes up only on my weekly > Adaware scan. that's all. > Quote: >> 6. So many features have been removed. I used to press the "sleep" button >> on my keyboard to turn the system off. Vista won't let me assign >> power-down >> to a sleep button. I guess Microsoft think I might get confused? > > How about Start-Sleep with your mouse? (It takes all of errr 0.5 seconds > longer than pressing a key....) > > Quote: >> 7. And so on... Removed features, inferior performance, little progress >> towards a good operating system. (It is truly amazing how many >> third-party utilities one has to purchase in order to > get a decent >> "operating system" environment.) > > It's truly amazing that I have purchased NO third-party utilities to get a > good stable working environment. > > > > I too have experience with many operating systems going back to the Commodore 64, Commodore Amiga 500 and 2000 and started with WFWG 3.1 on my first Windows pc. I have had a very positive experience with Vista now on 4 different PC's of my own. -- Little Charlie http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page...?bandID=861653 "Destroy your EGO and your ART will flourish"
My System Specs

10-12-2008	#7 (permalink)
oscar n/a posts	RE: Vista Experience The last resort of the inept and confused is to blame the Operating System. -- oscar ....Right click is your very good friend... "Nigel Bufton" wrote: Quote: > As many readers may not have "upgraded" to Vista yet, I thought that I'd log > some perspectives. > > FWIW, I have used scores of operating systems over the past forty years - > including Digital's VMS from which WNT (the forerunner of XP and presumably > Vista) was "lifted". For those who are not aware, V+1, M+1, S+1 = WNT = > Windows NT. (Microsoft's well-documented equivalent of the HAL/IBM pun.) > > Observations: > 1. Vista is very pretty. Far prettier than XP. If you like pretty, Vista > is for you. > 2. Windows Mail is truly awful. After importing my ONE mail when I upgraded, > WM decided to drop all the "Account" data fields in the import. It was > quite happy to include this column for mail I received subsequently, but as > I have 8 mail accounts and imported over 2,000 important emails, the loss of > into which accounts each of the previous emails came was a surprise for me. > Of course I am now stuck with it. I also used the "Outlook Bar" extensively. > Not permitted in WM though - Microsoft removed this capability. > 3. Windows Mail "Junk E-mail" filtering has the intelligence of a > three-year-old. (No offence intended to three-year-olds.) I am still > telling it what is junk and what is not junk after seven weeks of training. > Even Norton's Anti-Spam took only a few days of training to get 95% > correctly sorted. If Microsoft wants to serve its customers, they should > provide Norton (and others) whatever is needed so that these other companies > can apply their far superior methods for those of us who need intelligent > spam filtering in Windows Mail. > 4. Vista freezes and gets itself confused much more than XP. It's like > going back to Windows Me. It is years since I have had to restart Windows > so often. > 5. User Account Control is a real pain. For a single-user home system, its > paternalism is the most intrusive idiocy that I have ever encountered. Its > like walking around one's home with a little voice saying "do you really > mean to do this?" every time you do anything. It's enough to make one > consider leaving home. > 6. So many features have been removed. I used to press the "sleep" button > on my keyboard to turn the system off. Vista won't let me assign power-down > to a sleep button. I guess Microsoft think I might get confused? > 7. And so on... Removed features, inferior performance, little progress towards a good operating system. (It is truly amazing how many third-party utilities one has to purchase in order to get a decent "operating system" environment.) > > Microsoft, forget Windows 7 for now. My mother taught me to finish what was > on my plate before I could even think about afters. You certainly have a > lot of work to do to finish what is on your Vista plate. Get to work, > forget prettiness for a year or so, and get Vista SP2, SP3, etc. released > asap. > > Nigel > > > > > >
My System Specs

10-12-2008	#8 (permalink)
+Bob+ n/a posts	Re: Vista Experience On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 12:47:13 +0530, HappyAndyK <HappyAndyK.3h5pqo@xxxxxx> wrote: Quote: >Try Windows Live Mail instead. You will like it. No he won't. He has 8 mail accounts. With Windows Live Mail, he gets 8 Inbox's, 8 Sent Folders, 8 Draft Folders. Windows Live Mail is marginal for anyone with more than one email account, it sucks for anyone with "many" email accounts. Quote: >Is yours an OEM install? If so remove trialware and crapware. It solves >most issues. So a new install is supposed to fix the major bugs in Vista Networking? It's supposed to fix that fact that Vista is a bloated pig and runs twice as slow as XP? Quote: >Windows 7 is being built on Vista; so in a sense it is expected to >address most Vista disapointments. Or, more likely, it will have all the same disappointments - once more rearranged, dumbed down some more, and even more bugs as MS once again rewrites the OS instead of fixing the old one.
My System Specs

10-12-2008	#9 (permalink)
Ken Blake, MVP n/a posts	Re: Vista Experience On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 20:45:55 -0400, +Bob+ <uctraing@xxxxxx> wrote: Quote: > On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 12:47:13 +0530, HappyAndyK > <HappyAndyK.3h5pqo@xxxxxx> wrote: > Quote: > >Try Windows Live Mail instead. You will like it. > > No he won't. He has 8 mail accounts. With Windows Live Mail, he gets 8 > Inbox's, 8 Sent Folders, 8 Draft Folders. I've never used Windows Live Mail, and know next to nothing about it. What you state above is one of the things I didn't know, so I thank you for posting that information. It would certainly turn me off. Quote: > Windows Live Mail is > marginal for anyone with more than one email account, it sucks for > anyone with "many" email accounts. > Quote: > >Is yours an OEM install? If so remove trialware and crapware. It solves > >most issues. > > So a new install is supposed to fix the major bugs in Vista > Networking? It's supposed to fix that fact that Vista is a bloated pig > and runs twice as slow as XP? > Quote: > >Windows 7 is being built on Vista; so in a sense it is expected to > >address most Vista disapointments. > > Or, more likely, it will have all the same disappointments - once more > rearranged, dumbed down some more, and even more bugs as MS once again > rewrites the OS instead of fixing the old one. > > -- Ken Blake, Microsoft MVP - Windows Desktop Experience Please Reply to the Newsgroup
My System Specs

10-13-2008	#10 (permalink)
+Bob+ n/a posts	Re: Vista Experience On Sun, 12 Oct 2008 17:51:07 -0700, "Ken Blake, MVP" <kblake@xxxxxx> wrote: Quote: > >I've never used Windows Live Mail, and know next to nothing about it. >What you state above is one of the things I didn't know, so I thank >you for posting that information. It would certainly turn me off. > FWIW - MS missed the boat on WLMail and multiple accounts - which is disappointing, since they tout it as the product for people with multiple accounts. They force you to have separate folders. T-bird allows you to CHOSE to have separate folders on a per account basis or to share as you see fit. I ended up with T-bird as the only product that would run on multiple MS OS's and handle my dozen email accounts.
My System Specs

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