Vista - Vista Ultimate, Windows Backup, Full Image & Files, When Programs & Documents Are Uninstalled Or Deleted? Also, A Restore Point Regiistry Backup Question?

02-04-2009

I like using Windows Backup more then anything because of its
simplicity of use. I use both the Back Up Files backup automatically
and the Complete PC Backup image backup manually. Once you make your
initial backup future backups run quicker of course because you are
only backing up what has changed or is new. Here lies the question...

* If I delete files or uninstall programs that were previously backed
up and run my next Back Up Files or Complete PC Backup will these
deleted files and/or uninstalled programs be removed from the backups
too?

* Does backing up using either method include a new copy of the
Registry or only parts of the Registry that concern what was
changed--either added or deleted?

* Does a manual or automatic creation of a new Restore Point include
copies of the entire Registry files?

I have been relying on Restore Points as the easiest/best way of
backing up the Registry and to repairing the boot when it fails.

* I have kept protected operating system files hidden (recommended).
Can one still find these files (registry and restore point files)
grayed-out or are they invisible?

Thank you.

02-04-2009

On Wed, 04 Feb 2009 14:47:48 -0800, spamme0 <spamme9@xxxxxx> wrote:

Quote:

>I tried vista's backup one time. When I restored it, it didn't restore
>everything. I could get MY files restored, but not other's files.
>It takes so long to experiment to try to make it work, I just gave up
>and used a free third party tool. You can make a security argument
>that I shouldn't be able to back up YOUR files. But that's not acceptable
>on MY system.
>IIRC, if I swapped drives and restored, it didn't work either.
>
>Back up your system.
>Wipe your drive clean
>Restore the backup.
>If the result is not 100% the way it was when you started,
>your system wasn't backed up.

Just saying Vista backup doesn't say enough. Vista's 'Windows Backup'
has two different backup programs. 'Back Up Files' only backs up
certain files. 'Complete PC Backup backs up everything. Are you
certain which backup you used? If you only backed up Files but then
expected or needed your whole system restored it would fail.

Hopefully others will post and detail out my questions in the original
op?

~<Susan>~

Don't worry about the world coming to an end today.
It's already tomorrow in Australia. - Charles Schultz

02-04-2009

On Wed, 04 Feb 2009 14:47:48 -0800, spamme0 <spamme9@xxxxxx> wrote:

Quote:

>I tried vista's backup one time. When I restored it, it didn't restore
>everything. I could get MY files restored, but not other's files.
>It takes so long to experiment to try to make it work, I just gave up
>and used a free third party tool. You can make a security argument
>that I shouldn't be able to back up YOUR files. But that's not acceptable
>on MY system.
>IIRC, if I swapped drives and restored, it didn't work either.
>
>Back up your system.
>Wipe your drive clean
>Restore the backup.
>If the result is not 100% the way it was when you started,
>your system wasn't backed up.

Just saying Vista backup doesn't say enough. Vista's 'Windows Backup'
has two different backup programs. 'Back Up Files' only backs up
certain files. 'Complete PC Backup backs up everything. Are you
certain which backup you used? If you only backed up Files but then
expected or needed your whole system restored it would fail.

Hopefully others will post and detail out my questions in the original
op?

~<Susan>~

Don't worry about the world coming to an end today.
It's already tomorrow in Australia. - Charles Schultz

02-05-2009

On Thu, 05 Feb 2009 03:33:29 -0800, spamme0 <spamme9@xxxxxx> wrote:

Quote:

>I'm saying that I tried Complete PC Backup and I considered the restore
>to be a failure. It was a long time ago. I'm just suggesting that if you
>use the built-in program, you restore it on a bare drive to verify that
>it works...it didn't for me...in particular, go look for stuff that used to
>be there but you didn't have permissions to access. When I restored,
>not only did I not have access permissions, but the data wasn't there
>either. I gave up because I had options that DID work...and other fish
>to fry.
>There may be an easy way to make it work...but it didn't work for me.
>YMMV
>mike

Thank you Mike. Do you remember roughly how long ago your failure
was? Was it before SP1? You are still the only one who has
responded...I need some Microsoft MVP input please. Until I get some
consensus here how can I feel comfortable trusting Windows Vista's
backup programs?

~<Susan>~

Don't worry about the world coming to an end today.
It's already tomorrow in Australia. - Charles Schultz

02-07-2009

Susan wrote:

Quote:

> On Thu, 05 Feb 2009 03:33:29 -0800, spamme0 <spamme9@xxxxxx> wrote:
>

Quote:

>> I'm saying that I tried Complete PC Backup and I considered the restore
>> to be a failure. It was a long time ago. I'm just suggesting that if you
>> use the built-in program, you restore it on a bare drive to verify that
>> it works...it didn't for me...in particular, go look for stuff that used to
>> be there but you didn't have permissions to access. When I restored,
>> not only did I not have access permissions, but the data wasn't there
>> either. I gave up because I had options that DID work...and other fish
>> to fry.
>> There may be an easy way to make it work...but it didn't work for me.
>> YMMV
>> mike

>
> Thank you Mike. Do you remember roughly how long ago your failure
> was? Was it before SP1? You are still the only one who has
> responded...I need some Microsoft MVP input please. Until I get some
> consensus here how can I feel comfortable trusting Windows Vista's
> backup programs?
>
> ~<Susan>~
>
> Don't worry about the world coming to an end today.
> It's already tomorrow in Australia. - Charles Schultz

The tests I did originally were on a beta version of vista.
Last night, just for you, I did a backup on Vista SP1.
The backup proceeded without a hitch.
Then I swapped in a hard drive and tried to restore it.
Since the drive was a few MB smaller than the partition I backed up,
it would not restore. The partition was plenty big enough to
hold the restored backup, just wouldn't do it.
So, I can't tell if it would have worked.
Another problem I'd forgotten was that the backup was not compressed.
So, I wouldn't use it even if it did work. Having twice the media around
is a deal breaker for me.

My vista boot partition is only 16GB. My compressed boot partition
image fits on one DVD. And it will restore on any partition that is
at least as big as the resultant restored data.
I find that exceedingly convenient.
Acronis True Image 10. Free download if you
hurry...
http://www.acronis.co.uk/mag/ati10pe
mike

02-07-2009

On Sat, 07 Feb 2009 04:05:10 -0800, spamme0 <spamme9@xxxxxx> wrote:

Quote:

>The tests I did originally were on a beta version of vista.
>Last night, just for you, I did a backup on Vista SP1.
>The backup proceeded without a hitch.
>Then I swapped in a hard drive and tried to restore it.
>Since the drive was a few MB smaller than the partition I backed up,
>it would not restore. The partition was plenty big enough to
>hold the restored backup, just wouldn't do it.
>So, I can't tell if it would have worked.
>Another problem I'd forgotten was that the backup was not compressed.
>So, I wouldn't use it even if it did work. Having twice the media around
>is a deal breaker for me.

Compression isn't important here but hdd size might matter.

Quote:

>My vista boot partition is only 16GB. My compressed boot partition
>image fits on one DVD. And it will restore on any partition that is
>at least as big as the resultant restored data.
>I find that exceedingly convenient.
>Acronis True Image 10. Free download if you
>hurry...
>http://www.acronis.co.uk/mag/ati10pe
>mike

I almost started using Acronis when I discovered Windows Backup looked
like it did all the tricks I needed and have been happy with it so
far... But I can't risk testing the restore--if it doesn't work I'm
doing a clean install from scratch and right now I just hate that
thought. Vista SP1 is working great.

This thread subject doesn't seem to be drawing in other comments so
let me ask you directly one more thing I've tried to cover...

Do backup programs, Vista Ultimate Backups and Acronis in particular
remove deleted or uninstalled programs from their incremental backups
or is this why one must periodically create new backups?

Thanks.

02-07-2009

Susan <UCE@xxxxxx> wrote:

Quote:

>Compression isn't important here but hdd size might matter.

Size ALWAYS matters!

(sorry... I couldn't stop myself)

02-04-2009	#1 (permalink)
Susan n/a posts	Vista Ultimate, Windows Backup, Full Image & Files, When Programs & Documents Are Uninstalled Or Deleted? Also, A Restore Point Regiistry Backup Question? I like using Windows Backup more then anything because of its simplicity of use. I use both the Back Up Files backup automatically and the Complete PC Backup image backup manually. Once you make your initial backup future backups run quicker of course because you are only backing up what has changed or is new. Here lies the question... * If I delete files or uninstall programs that were previously backed up and run my next Back Up Files or Complete PC Backup will these deleted files and/or uninstalled programs be removed from the backups too? * Does backing up using either method include a new copy of the Registry or only parts of the Registry that concern what was changed--either added or deleted? * Does a manual or automatic creation of a new Restore Point include copies of the entire Registry files? I have been relying on Restore Points as the easiest/best way of backing up the Registry and to repairing the boot when it fails. * I have kept protected operating system files hidden (recommended). Can one still find these files (registry and restore point files) grayed-out or are they invisible? Thank you.
My System Specs

02-04-2009	#2 (permalink)
Susan n/a posts	Re: Vista Ultimate, Windows Backup, Full Image & Files, When Programs & Documents Are Uninstalled Or Deleted? Also, A Restore Point Regiistry Backup Question? On Wed, 04 Feb 2009 14:47:48 -0800, spamme0 <spamme9@xxxxxx> wrote: Quote: >I tried vista's backup one time. When I restored it, it didn't restore >everything. I could get MY files restored, but not other's files. >It takes so long to experiment to try to make it work, I just gave up >and used a free third party tool. You can make a security argument >that I shouldn't be able to back up YOUR files. But that's not acceptable >on MY system. >IIRC, if I swapped drives and restored, it didn't work either. > >Back up your system. >Wipe your drive clean >Restore the backup. >If the result is not 100% the way it was when you started, >your system wasn't backed up. Just saying Vista backup doesn't say enough. Vista's 'Windows Backup' has two different backup programs. 'Back Up Files' only backs up certain files. 'Complete PC Backup backs up everything. Are you certain which backup you used? If you only backed up Files but then expected or needed your whole system restored it would fail. Hopefully others will post and detail out my questions in the original op? ~<Susan>~ Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia. - Charles Schultz
My System Specs

02-04-2009	#3 (permalink)
Susan n/a posts	Re: Vista Ultimate, Windows Backup, Full Image & Files, When Programs & Documents Are Uninstalled Or Deleted? Also, A Restore Point Regiistry Backup Question? On Wed, 04 Feb 2009 14:47:48 -0800, spamme0 <spamme9@xxxxxx> wrote: Quote: >I tried vista's backup one time. When I restored it, it didn't restore >everything. I could get MY files restored, but not other's files. >It takes so long to experiment to try to make it work, I just gave up >and used a free third party tool. You can make a security argument >that I shouldn't be able to back up YOUR files. But that's not acceptable >on MY system. >IIRC, if I swapped drives and restored, it didn't work either. > >Back up your system. >Wipe your drive clean >Restore the backup. >If the result is not 100% the way it was when you started, >your system wasn't backed up. Just saying Vista backup doesn't say enough. Vista's 'Windows Backup' has two different backup programs. 'Back Up Files' only backs up certain files. 'Complete PC Backup backs up everything. Are you certain which backup you used? If you only backed up Files but then expected or needed your whole system restored it would fail. Hopefully others will post and detail out my questions in the original op? ~<Susan>~ Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia. - Charles Schultz
My System Specs

02-05-2009	#4 (permalink)
Susan n/a posts	Re: Vista Ultimate, Windows Backup, Full Image & Files, When Programs & Documents Are Uninstalled Or Deleted? Also, A Restore Point Regiistry Backup Question? On Thu, 05 Feb 2009 03:33:29 -0800, spamme0 <spamme9@xxxxxx> wrote: Quote: >I'm saying that I tried Complete PC Backup and I considered the restore >to be a failure. It was a long time ago. I'm just suggesting that if you >use the built-in program, you restore it on a bare drive to verify that >it works...it didn't for me...in particular, go look for stuff that used to >be there but you didn't have permissions to access. When I restored, >not only did I not have access permissions, but the data wasn't there >either. I gave up because I had options that DID work...and other fish >to fry. >There may be an easy way to make it work...but it didn't work for me. >YMMV >mike Thank you Mike. Do you remember roughly how long ago your failure was? Was it before SP1? You are still the only one who has responded...I need some Microsoft MVP input please. Until I get some consensus here how can I feel comfortable trusting Windows Vista's backup programs? ~<Susan>~ Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. It's already tomorrow in Australia. - Charles Schultz
My System Specs

02-07-2009	#5 (permalink)
spamme0 n/a posts	Re: Vista Ultimate, Windows Backup, Full Image & Files, When Programs& Documents Are Uninstalled Or Deleted? Also, A Restore Point RegiistryBackup Question? Susan wrote: Quote: > On Thu, 05 Feb 2009 03:33:29 -0800, spamme0 <spamme9@xxxxxx> wrote: > Quote: >> I'm saying that I tried Complete PC Backup and I considered the restore >> to be a failure. It was a long time ago. I'm just suggesting that if you >> use the built-in program, you restore it on a bare drive to verify that >> it works...it didn't for me...in particular, go look for stuff that used to >> be there but you didn't have permissions to access. When I restored, >> not only did I not have access permissions, but the data wasn't there >> either. I gave up because I had options that DID work...and other fish >> to fry. >> There may be an easy way to make it work...but it didn't work for me. >> YMMV >> mike > > Thank you Mike. Do you remember roughly how long ago your failure > was? Was it before SP1? You are still the only one who has > responded...I need some Microsoft MVP input please. Until I get some > consensus here how can I feel comfortable trusting Windows Vista's > backup programs? > > ~<Susan>~ > > Don't worry about the world coming to an end today. > It's already tomorrow in Australia. - Charles Schultz The tests I did originally were on a beta version of vista. Last night, just for you, I did a backup on Vista SP1. The backup proceeded without a hitch. Then I swapped in a hard drive and tried to restore it. Since the drive was a few MB smaller than the partition I backed up, it would not restore. The partition was plenty big enough to hold the restored backup, just wouldn't do it. So, I can't tell if it would have worked. Another problem I'd forgotten was that the backup was not compressed. So, I wouldn't use it even if it did work. Having twice the media around is a deal breaker for me. My vista boot partition is only 16GB. My compressed boot partition image fits on one DVD. And it will restore on any partition that is at least as big as the resultant restored data. I find that exceedingly convenient. Acronis True Image 10. Free download if you hurry... http://www.acronis.co.uk/mag/ati10pe mike
My System Specs

02-07-2009	#6 (permalink)
Susan n/a posts	Re: Vista Ultimate, Windows Backup, Full Image & Files, When Programs & Documents Are Uninstalled Or Deleted? Also, A Restore Point Regiistry Backup Question? On Sat, 07 Feb 2009 04:05:10 -0800, spamme0 <spamme9@xxxxxx> wrote: Quote: >The tests I did originally were on a beta version of vista. >Last night, just for you, I did a backup on Vista SP1. >The backup proceeded without a hitch. >Then I swapped in a hard drive and tried to restore it. >Since the drive was a few MB smaller than the partition I backed up, >it would not restore. The partition was plenty big enough to >hold the restored backup, just wouldn't do it. >So, I can't tell if it would have worked. >Another problem I'd forgotten was that the backup was not compressed. >So, I wouldn't use it even if it did work. Having twice the media around >is a deal breaker for me. Compression isn't important here but hdd size might matter. Quote: >My vista boot partition is only 16GB. My compressed boot partition >image fits on one DVD. And it will restore on any partition that is >at least as big as the resultant restored data. >I find that exceedingly convenient. >Acronis True Image 10. Free download if you >hurry... >http://www.acronis.co.uk/mag/ati10pe >mike I almost started using Acronis when I discovered Windows Backup looked like it did all the tricks I needed and have been happy with it so far... But I can't risk testing the restore--if it doesn't work I'm doing a clean install from scratch and right now I just hate that thought. Vista SP1 is working great. This thread subject doesn't seem to be drawing in other comments so let me ask you directly one more thing I've tried to cover... Do backup programs, Vista Ultimate Backups and Acronis in particular remove deleted or uninstalled programs from their incremental backups or is this why one must periodically create new backups? Thanks.
My System Specs

02-07-2009	#7 (permalink)
Mike Torello n/a posts	Re: Vista Ultimate, Windows Backup, Full Image & Files, When Programs & Documents Are Uninstalled Or Deleted? Also, A Restore Point Regiistry Backup Question? Susan <UCE@xxxxxx> wrote: Quote: >Compression isn't important here but hdd size might matter. Size ALWAYS matters! (sorry... I couldn't stop myself)
My System Specs

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