Vista Tutorial - Bad Ubuntu

Great idea. Go to South Central and peddle Ubuntu at 3 AM, but you should
include Monday thru Friday!


"Alias" <aka@maskedandanonymous.info> wrote in message
news:exTZCaWxHHA.4916@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> Mike wrote:
>> In article <lZmdncHHjvqqAQrbnZ2dnUVZ8vidnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>> Stephan Rose <nospam@spammer.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Here is the release policy:
>>>
>>> LTS Releases are supported for 3 years (5 years server). All other
>>> releases
>>> have 1 year support. When the current LTS expires, a new release is made
>>> available with LTS support.
>>>
>>> What's so terribly difficult to understand about this?
>>
>> Nothing actually. What it means is Ubuntu is not something to run a
>> business on. 3 years?!?! 1 year?!?! Wow, and people complain about
>> the "MS upgrade treadmill"! MS is still supporting Windows 2000 after 8
>> years and XP after 6 years.
>>
>> No business wants OS upgrades forced on them every 3 years in order to
>> stay supported. If MS did that you would be screaming "monopoly"!
>> Mike
>
> Ubuntu upgrades are totally painless. If you're a business, you back up
> your data. Installing a new version of Ubuntu is a nice walk in the park
> compared to Windows which could be likened to taking a walk in South
> Central LA at 3AM on a Sunday morning.
>
> Alias

Alias wrote:

> Frank wrote:
>
>> Alias wrote:
>>
>>> Frank wrote:
>>>
>>>> Alias wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> NOT Alias - Thank GOD wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Ubuntu is often hailed as the future for the GNU/Linux desktop and
>>>>>> even for the server. This page is dedicated to exploring the
>>>>>> downsides to Ubuntu.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No established release policy
>>>>>> Once concerned with a production-ready release every 6 months,
>>>>>> Ubuntu have now decided that some releases will be "LTS" - long
>>>>>> term supported. It's hard to depend on a distribution with no set
>>>>>> release policy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You don't get the whole of Debian
>>>>>> Whilst the core packages are supported, this is only a few hundred
>>>>>> of the 20,000 available in the Debian repositories. The rest are
>>>>>> not guaranteed to work, and indeed many don't.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jumping the gun
>>>>>> You get a very hot off the press Gnome and Evolution suite with
>>>>>> Ubuntu, even in the LTS version. There are bugs that don't get
>>>>>> fixed on the first Gnome and Evolution major releases. You know
>>>>>> the score, 2.00 some bugs, 2.01 getting better, 2.02 finally
>>>>>> fixed. But with Ubuntu you get the 2.00 release for it's cutting
>>>>>> edge package. These don't get fixed up even in the LTS releases.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Easy installer or working installer
>>>>>> The installer for Ubuntu is in a state that most projects would
>>>>>> consider experimental. Your mileage may vary.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Non-Free
>>>>>> Ubuntu have been toying with the idea of including non-free
>>>>>> software. Whilst other distributions like Debian do this, they
>>>>>> have a very clear cut policy of not having such software on their
>>>>>> installers, and making the non-free repositories a separate choice
>>>>>> inclusion. There is no such division in Ubuntu repositories.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lack of Multimedia
>>>>>> So, you may be lumbered non-free stuff you don't want, but when it
>>>>>> comes to getting multimedia codecs (including those openly
>>>>>> licensed but patent encumbered in some countries), Ubuntu is not
>>>>>> so well supported as Debian. The repositories at
>>>>>> http://debian-multimedia.org are a one stop shop for Debian
>>>>>> multimedia, but don't support Ubuntu.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> All lies.
>>>>>
>>>>> Alias
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Prove they are all lies or STFU!
>>>> Frank
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Prove they aren't or STFU!
>>>
>>> Alias
>>
>>
>> You idiot! You're the one calling them lies now YOU prove they're not
>> or STFU!
>> Well...!
>> Frank
>
>
> Well nothing. They're lies. What makes you think I care if you believe
> me or not?
>
> Alias

Then why do you keep responding mr atheists?
Frank

On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 11:53:49 -0400, Mike wrote:

> In article <lZmdncHHjvqqAQrbnZ2dnUVZ8vidnZ2d@giganews.com>,
> Stephan Rose <nospam@spammer.com> wrote:
>
>
>> Here is the release policy:
>>
>> LTS Releases are supported for 3 years (5 years server). All other releases
>> have 1 year support. When the current LTS expires, a new release is made
>> available with LTS support.
>>
>> What's so terribly difficult to understand about this?
>
> Nothing actually. What it means is Ubuntu is not something to run a
> business on. 3 years?!?! 1 year?!?! Wow, and people complain
> about the "MS upgrade treadmill"! MS is still supporting Windows 2000
> after 8 years and XP after 6 years.
>
> No business wants OS upgrades forced on them every 3 years in order to
> stay supported. If MS did that you would be screaming "monopoly"!

Well for one, as alias has stated, doing upgrades is far more painless
than it is under windows. It comes down to clicking the "Upgrade" button
and grabbing a cup of coffee while the system goes to do its thing and
then continuing to use your system like nothing ever happened after a
quick reboot. It's not like the windows world where in-place upgrades are
a nightmare and you generally need to wipe the entire machine clean to do
a reasonable windows upgrade.

That said, there are also paid enterprise support packages available from
Canonical for more support aimed particularly at businesses that I am sure
will address such concerns as yours. Which I fully agree with you, for a
company that has a few hundred or more machines sitting there, it isn't
feasible upgrading them every couple years.

--
Stephan
2003 Yamaha R6

������出�日�ん�����
����忘れ�������ら

Alias wrote:

> Mike wrote:
>
>> In article <lZmdncHHjvqqAQrbnZ2dnUVZ8vidnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>> Stephan Rose <nospam@spammer.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Here is the release policy:
>>>
>>> LTS Releases are supported for 3 years (5 years server). All other
>>> releases
>>> have 1 year support. When the current LTS expires, a new release is made
>>> available with LTS support.
>>>
>>> What's so terribly difficult to understand about this?
>>
>>
>> Nothing actually. What it means is Ubuntu is not something to run a
>> business on. 3 years?!?! 1 year?!?! Wow, and people complain
>> about the "MS upgrade treadmill"! MS is still supporting Windows
>> 2000 after 8 years and XP after 6 years.
>>
>> No business wants OS upgrades forced on them every 3 years in order to
>> stay supported. If MS did that you would be screaming "monopoly"!
>> Mike
>
>
> Ubuntu upgrades are totally painless. If you're a business, you back up
> your data. Installing a new version of Ubuntu is a nice walk in the park
> compared to Windows which could be likened to taking a walk in South
> Central LA at 3AM on a Sunday morning.
>
> Alias

If you're a business (a real business) you're not using a toy os like linux.
Period!
Frank

Bill Yanaire wrote:
> Great idea. Go to South Central and peddle Ubuntu at 3 AM, but you should
> include Monday thru Friday!

Again, what I wrote went right over your head.

Alias
>
>
> "Alias" <aka@maskedandanonymous.info> wrote in message
> news:exTZCaWxHHA.4916@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> Mike wrote:
>>> In article <lZmdncHHjvqqAQrbnZ2dnUVZ8vidnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>>> Stephan Rose <nospam@spammer.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Here is the release policy:
>>>>
>>>> LTS Releases are supported for 3 years (5 years server). All other
>>>> releases
>>>> have 1 year support. When the current LTS expires, a new release is made
>>>> available with LTS support.
>>>>
>>>> What's so terribly difficult to understand about this?
>>> Nothing actually. What it means is Ubuntu is not something to run a
>>> business on. 3 years?!?! 1 year?!?! Wow, and people complain about
>>> the "MS upgrade treadmill"! MS is still supporting Windows 2000 after 8
>>> years and XP after 6 years.
>>>
>>> No business wants OS upgrades forced on them every 3 years in order to
>>> stay supported. If MS did that you would be screaming "monopoly"!
>>> Mike
>> Ubuntu upgrades are totally painless. If you're a business, you back up
>> your data. Installing a new version of Ubuntu is a nice walk in the park
>> compared to Windows which could be likened to taking a walk in South
>> Central LA at 3AM on a Sunday morning.
>>
>> Alias
>
>

Stephan Rose wrote:
> On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 17:47:08 +0200, Alias wrote:
>
>> Frank wrote:
>>> Alias wrote:
>>>> Frank wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Alias wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> NOT Alias - Thank GOD wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ubuntu is often hailed as the future for the GNU/Linux desktop and
>>>>>>> even for the server. This page is dedicated to exploring the
>>>>>>> downsides to Ubuntu.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No established release policy
>>>>>>> Once concerned with a production-ready release every 6 months,
>>>>>>> Ubuntu have now decided that some releases will be "LTS" - long
>>>>>>> term supported. It's hard to depend on a distribution with no set
>>>>>>> release policy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You don't get the whole of Debian
>>>>>>> Whilst the core packages are supported, this is only a few hundred
>>>>>>> of the 20,000 available in the Debian repositories. The rest are
>>>>>>> not guaranteed to work, and indeed many don't.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jumping the gun
>>>>>>> You get a very hot off the press Gnome and Evolution suite with
>>>>>>> Ubuntu, even in the LTS version. There are bugs that don't get
>>>>>>> fixed on the first Gnome and Evolution major releases. You know the
>>>>>>> score, 2.00 some bugs, 2.01 getting better, 2.02 finally fixed. But
>>>>>>> with Ubuntu you get the 2.00 release for it's cutting edge package.
>>>>>>> These don't get fixed up even in the LTS releases.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Easy installer or working installer
>>>>>>> The installer for Ubuntu is in a state that most projects would
>>>>>>> consider experimental. Your mileage may vary.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Non-Free
>>>>>>> Ubuntu have been toying with the idea of including non-free
>>>>>>> software. Whilst other distributions like Debian do this, they have
>>>>>>> a very clear cut policy of not having such software on their
>>>>>>> installers, and making the non-free repositories a separate choice
>>>>>>> inclusion. There is no such division in Ubuntu repositories.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lack of Multimedia
>>>>>>> So, you may be lumbered non-free stuff you don't want, but when it
>>>>>>> comes to getting multimedia codecs (including those openly licensed
>>>>>>> but patent encumbered in some countries), Ubuntu is not so well
>>>>>>> supported as Debian. The repositories at
>>>>>>> http://debian-multimedia.org are a one stop shop for Debian
>>>>>>> multimedia, but don't support Ubuntu.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> All lies.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Alias
>>>>>
>>>>> Prove they are all lies or STFU!
>>>>> Frank
>>>>
>>>> Prove they aren't or STFU!
>>>>
>>>> Alias
>>> You idiot! You're the one calling them lies now YOU prove they're not or
>>> STFU!
>>> Well...!
>>> Frank
>> Well nothing. They're lies. What makes you think I care if you believe
>> me or not?
>>
>
> Maybe the fact that neither one of you two can STFU??? I mean seriously!
> The both of you need to go do that! If you got something constructive to
> say, say it. But this constant and childish "You shut up" "no you shut up"
> "no you shut up" "you are a liar" "no you are a liar" "no you are" "no you
> are" back and forth between the two of you is really just stupid.
>
> If you don't have something useful to say, just don't say anything. Is
> that really so hard? Or at least take your childish games to e-mail.
>

I'll try to control myself. It *is* silly.

Alias

On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 09:15:22 -0700, Frank wrote:

> Alias wrote:
>
>> Mike wrote:
>>
>>> In article <lZmdncHHjvqqAQrbnZ2dnUVZ8vidnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>>> Stephan Rose <nospam@spammer.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Here is the release policy:
>>>>
>>>> LTS Releases are supported for 3 years (5 years server). All other
>>>> releases
>>>> have 1 year support. When the current LTS expires, a new release is made
>>>> available with LTS support.
>>>>
>>>> What's so terribly difficult to understand about this?
>>>
>>>
>>> Nothing actually. What it means is Ubuntu is not something to run a
>>> business on. 3 years?!?! 1 year?!?! Wow, and people complain
>>> about the "MS upgrade treadmill"! MS is still supporting Windows
>>> 2000 after 8 years and XP after 6 years.
>>>
>>> No business wants OS upgrades forced on them every 3 years in order to
>>> stay supported. If MS did that you would be screaming "monopoly"!
>>> Mike
>>
>>
>> Ubuntu upgrades are totally painless. If you're a business, you back up
>> your data. Installing a new version of Ubuntu is a nice walk in the park
>> compared to Windows which could be likened to taking a walk in South
>> Central LA at 3AM on a Sunday morning.
>>
>> Alias
>
> If you're a business (a real business) you're not using a toy os like linux.
> Period!

Frank, come on now. Tell that to the company that produced Shrek 3 on
Linux based render farms just to name one very public example.

Tell that to me who does real business just fine on linux machines.

Tell that to the thousands of server companies that host linux servers on
a daily basis and make their living from it.

I could go on...

Both operating systems have their pros and cons. Both operating systems
have their uses. Both have their place in the business world.

--
Stephan
2003 Yamaha R6

������出�日�ん�����
����忘れ�������ら

No it didn't go over my head at all. I have updated Ubuntu with those 81
updates and they did install without a problem. I choose not to use Ubuntu
for reasons we have already discussed. I read what you wrote but chose to
say what I said. I guess you don't like the idea. You want to peddle
Ubuntu to the people so maybe you should get out there.


"Bill Yanaire" <bill@yanaire.com> wrote in message
news:eRDVGeWxHHA.3720@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> Great idea. Go to South Central and peddle Ubuntu at 3 AM, but you should
> include Monday thru Friday!
>
>
> "Alias" <aka@maskedandanonymous.info> wrote in message
> news:exTZCaWxHHA.4916@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> Mike wrote:
>>> In article <lZmdncHHjvqqAQrbnZ2dnUVZ8vidnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>>> Stephan Rose <nospam@spammer.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Here is the release policy:
>>>>
>>>> LTS Releases are supported for 3 years (5 years server). All other
>>>> releases
>>>> have 1 year support. When the current LTS expires, a new release is
>>>> made
>>>> available with LTS support.
>>>>
>>>> What's so terribly difficult to understand about this?
>>>
>>> Nothing actually. What it means is Ubuntu is not something to run a
>>> business on. 3 years?!?! 1 year?!?! Wow, and people complain
>>> about the "MS upgrade treadmill"! MS is still supporting Windows 2000
>>> after 8 years and XP after 6 years.
>>>
>>> No business wants OS upgrades forced on them every 3 years in order to
>>> stay supported. If MS did that you would be screaming "monopoly"! Mike
>>
>> Ubuntu upgrades are totally painless. If you're a business, you back up
>> your data. Installing a new version of Ubuntu is a nice walk in the park
>> compared to Windows which could be likened to taking a walk in South
>> Central LA at 3AM on a Sunday morning.
>>
>> Alias
>
>

"Alias" <aka@maskedandanonymous.info> wrote in message
news:exTZCaWxHHA.4916@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> No business wants OS upgrades forced on them every 3 years in order to
>> stay supported. If MS did that you would be screaming "monopoly"!
>> Mike
>
> Ubuntu upgrades are totally painless.

Sure it is. For hundreds or thousands of machines? Every 3 years?
Whether you want to or not?

Right. Now pull the other one.

If MS did this you would be screaming "monopoly"!

Mike

That's funny. When I do an upgrade, I don't have those nightmare problems
or issues you mentioned. Yes, it does take a reboot, but usually Windows
runs OK after the updates. I think the reason most people have problems is
because when they upgrade to Vista, they upgrade over a damaged version of
their current OS, bringing problems along with them. They don't have
current antivirus so they also introduce viruses and other problems. People
don't pay attention to the hardware factor. They install Vista on a PC
which isn't designed for Vista and complain.

If they follow common sense, most problems would go away. Yes, there will
always be problems, but Vista is much more complicated than that toy Ubuntu
OS.

For playing and tinkering, use Ubuntu.
For heavy lifting and real work, use a solution that will get the job done.
Windoze !


"Stephan Rose" <nospam@spammer.com> wrote in message
news:lZmdncLHjvo8OQrbnZ2dnUVZ8vidnZ2d@giganews.com...
> On Fri, 13 Jul 2007 11:53:49 -0400, Mike wrote:
>
>> In article <lZmdncHHjvqqAQrbnZ2dnUVZ8vidnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>> Stephan Rose <nospam@spammer.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Here is the release policy:
>>>
>>> LTS Releases are supported for 3 years (5 years server). All other
>>> releases
>>> have 1 year support. When the current LTS expires, a new release is made
>>> available with LTS support.
>>>
>>> What's so terribly difficult to understand about this?
>>
>> Nothing actually. What it means is Ubuntu is not something to run a
>> business on. 3 years?!?! 1 year?!?! Wow, and people complain
>> about the "MS upgrade treadmill"! MS is still supporting Windows 2000
>> after 8 years and XP after 6 years.
>>
>> No business wants OS upgrades forced on them every 3 years in order to
>> stay supported. If MS did that you would be screaming "monopoly"!
>
> Well for one, as alias has stated, doing upgrades is far more painless
> than it is under windows. It comes down to clicking the "Upgrade" button
> and grabbing a cup of coffee while the system goes to do its thing and
> then continuing to use your system like nothing ever happened after a
> quick reboot. It's not like the windows world where in-place upgrades are
> a nightmare and you generally need to wipe the entire machine clean to do
> a reasonable windows upgrade.
>
> That said, there are also paid enterprise support packages available from
> Canonical for more support aimed particularly at businesses that I am sure
> will address such concerns as yours. Which I fully agree with you, for a
> company that has a few hundred or more machines sitting there, it isn't
> feasible upgrading them every couple years.
>
> --
> Stephan
> 2003 Yamaha R6
>
> ????????????????
> ??????????????