Vista - Windows Photo Gallery (WPG) - appalling display quality

Actually, Media Center has a slide show mode and is definitely designed for
a 10 foot view and television. I don't think Photo Gallery was designed for
that at all. It just sucks. That's all.

Dale

"Slugsie" <slugsie_no_spim@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:O6Y51BVRHHA.4060@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
>I think that when Photo Gallery goes into SlideShow mode (click the big
>square button at center bottom) it drops down to a very low resolution to
>display the images. This has obvious problems. If you double click an image
>whilst in the thumbnail mode it keeps your current resolution, and thus
>does a much better job of viewing images, at least for me anyway.
>
> I think that the SlideShow mode is designed for viewing images on a device
> like a TV, using a '10 foot interface' (as MS like to call it). It's not
> designed to be used sat at the desktop (a '2 foot interface').
>
> Oh, and I agree, it sucks.
>
> --
> </Slugsie>
> "Simon Cobb" <Simon Cobb@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news87B1CA7-C835-4B32-81DE-B8D81AA08C53@microsoft.com...
>> I'm running Vista Ultimate RTM on a high end system. I just loaded
>> 60-odd
>> JPG images taken with a Nikon D40 DSLR onto my PC and viewed them through
>> WPG. Given this was a brand new camera and these were the first images I
>> had
>> shot, I was horrified with their quality and initially assumed my camera
>> was
>> faulty. The images were terribly over-saturated, unsharp and noisy. I
>> then
>> opened the images for editing in Microsoft Digital Image Suite. Lo and
>> behold, the images are sharp and properly saturated.
>>
>> While I'm relieved that my camera is performing correctly, what on earth
>> is
>> going on with WPG to cause such appalling display characteristics?
>>
>> Incidentally, I saw similarly poor results when I viewed the images in
>> the
>> new Slide Show viewer.
>>
>> Anyone else seen similar results? Is there a fix?
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Simon
>

THANK YOU, THANK YOU!!!!!

I was experiencing the same problem, and my wife wasn't happy with the Vista
upgrade!

This problem may be specific to Samsung monitors, or possibly just the 205BW
(which I also have). This might or might not be a Microsoft problem. Seems
likely that it could be Samsung's problem, although if Microsoft is shipping
a bad color profile, even if it was provided by Samsung, Microsoft should
definitely provide a fix.

-- Greg


"Redbeaver" wrote:

> I FOUND THE SOLUTION!!!!!
>
>
>
> First off, there r 2 solutions i discovered...one is if u have Photoshop
> installed, the other if you don't.
>
> If you do have, in Control Panel, there's an Adobe Gamma tool. Run it by
> step-by-step wizard (or by Control Panel if u know what u'r doing) and create
> ur own Profile. Name it anything, i name mine Vista-1 just so its easier to
> see. It will create an ICM profile immediately installed in Window's
> system32-spool-color folder (given u dont change the saving location. better
> yet, dont even try.). Done?
> Back in Vista's control panel, open the Colour Management tool. In there
> u'll see the default ICC profile, mine named Samsung - Natural Color Pro 1.0
> ICM, file name SM205BW.icm since my monitor is a Samsung 205BW. Click on
> Add.., and if you scroll down, u'll see ur profile; again, mine said Vista-1.
> U might need to click on Browse.. if u dont see yours becoz u saved it
> somewhere else...
> [Now, this part i'm not sure whether u need to do it, but i did it
> anyway.... Click on the Profiles button on the right bottom corner and click
> on Combine My Settings with System Defaults. then...]
> Click OK, and click on Vista-1 and click on Set as Default Profile. Click
> Close.
>
> Now try opening a picture in WPG
>
> Ooops, almost forgot, for people who doesnt have Photoshop, u can google any
> free ICC profile or go to:
> http://www.adobe.com/digitalimag/adobergb.html
> Download these free ICC, and install some..or..well... i tried installing
> all of them anyway... Just extract them, then right click and select
> Install...
>
> Now go to Vista Control Panel, open Color Management, and click on Add...
> Scroll down and all of the installed ICC should be there. Pick one and set it
> default. [Again, u could click on Profiles and select Combine My Profile...
> but im not sure about this.] Click Close and you're good to go.
>
> Of course if it still shows the wrong colour just pick a different ICC and
> try it. First ICC i tried is the Adobe1998 one and it seems to be working
> fine... Of course im no expert and if any of u experts sees the better ICC in
> there (there r like 10~15 of them in the ZIP), by all means correct me.
>
> THat's all.
>
> Hope that helps
>
>
> "Dale" wrote:
>
> > That's why I love free markets. The more non-Microsoft solutions there are
> > to problems with Vista, the more Microsoft will learn to listen to its true
> > customers over and above its partners.
> >
> > Dale
> >
> > "Michael J" <MichaelJ@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> > news:854D98CF-E011-4620-A9F7-D59BD6C84261@microsoft.com...
> > > Redbeaver,
> > >
> > > I opened your image in Vista Windows Photo Gallery and then again in
> > > Exlorer
> > > AND Photoshop and you can CLEARLY see the poor image quality in W.Photo
> > > Gallery!
> > >
> > > In Windows Photo Gallery:
> > > 1. The image is much darker than the photoshop (reference and color
> > > monitored image)
> > > 2. The image exhibits obvious pixelation in the clouds in the center and
> > > center right of the image
> > > 3. The image looks artificially saturated beyond the reference image in
> > > Photoshop (which is an ICC color aware environment).
> > >
> > > Everyone I've spoken to who now has Vista has noticed this problem. To the
> > > novice , the problem may not be apparent at first. However, to the
> > > photographer and just about anyone else who is color aware, can see this
> > > problem. I really wish Microsoft will address this as soon as possible.
> > > Meanwhile, I have switched to Google's Picasa as my picture photo gallery
> > > (to
> > > manage images) and it totally ROCKS. I encouraged those frustrated by this
> > > Vista Windows Photo Gallery problem, to try out Picasa - I think you will
> > > like it.
> > >
> > > -Michael
> > >
> > > "
> > >>
> > >> "Redbeaver" <Redbeaver@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> > >> news:A292B8D6-65E1-4047-8B44-AA8C6E2C5DFA@microsoft.com...
> > >> > There you go, guys... sorry about the triple posting...
> > >> >
> > >> > Original Pic:
> > >> > http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/189/errorla7.jpg
> > >> >
> > >> > as wallapaper/WPG/Paint:
> > >> > http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/6475/errorvt6.jpg
> > >> >
> > >> > See what i mean? Anybody can correct this so far?
> > >> >
> > >> > Microsoft should fix this ASAP as WPG is the program i used to use all
> > >> > the
> > >> > time with XP
> > >> >
> > >> > Thank you............
> > >> >
> > >> > "Redbeaver" wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> >> DARN!! i uploaded the wrong picture... i will upload another one at
> > >> >> home....
> > >> >> sorry, guys... im at the office now...
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Ah yes, and i forgot to mention, and since i couldnt find the edit
> > >> >> button,
> > >> >> here goes:
> > >> >>
> > >> >> My system:
> > >> >> AMD X2 3800+
> > >> >> 2Gb RAM
> > >> >> 2x7900GT on SLI using Forceware 97.46
> > >> >> Samsung 205BW
> > >> >> Vista Ultimate OEM
> > >> >>
> > >> >> Thanks!
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> >
> >

MS does not check to see if drivers supplied by manufacturers do everything
the manufacturer claims. MS insures that the can be installed and that they
meet MS specs for stability secu;rity and methods of communicating with the
OS.

"Greg" <Greg@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news51E72F8-9798-4250-AAD4-CAE94855820D@microsoft.com...
> THANK YOU, THANK YOU!!!!!
>
> I was experiencing the same problem, and my wife wasn't happy with the
> Vista
> upgrade!
>
> This problem may be specific to Samsung monitors, or possibly just the
> 205BW
> (which I also have). This might or might not be a Microsoft problem. Seems
> likely that it could be Samsung's problem, although if Microsoft is
> shipping
> a bad color profile, even if it was provided by Samsung, Microsoft should
> definitely provide a fix.
>
> -- Greg
>
>
> "Redbeaver" wrote:
>
>> I FOUND THE SOLUTION!!!!!
>>
>>
>>
>> First off, there r 2 solutions i discovered...one is if u have Photoshop
>> installed, the other if you don't.
>>
>> If you do have, in Control Panel, there's an Adobe Gamma tool. Run it by
>> step-by-step wizard (or by Control Panel if u know what u'r doing) and
>> create
>> ur own Profile. Name it anything, i name mine Vista-1 just so its easier
>> to
>> see. It will create an ICM profile immediately installed in Window's
>> system32-spool-color folder (given u dont change the saving location.
>> better
>> yet, dont even try.). Done?
>> Back in Vista's control panel, open the Colour Management tool. In there
>> u'll see the default ICC profile, mine named Samsung - Natural Color Pro
>> 1.0
>> ICM, file name SM205BW.icm since my monitor is a Samsung 205BW. Click on
>> Add.., and if you scroll down, u'll see ur profile; again, mine said
>> Vista-1.
>> U might need to click on Browse.. if u dont see yours becoz u saved it
>> somewhere else...
>> [Now, this part i'm not sure whether u need to do it, but i did it
>> anyway.... Click on the Profiles button on the right bottom corner and
>> click
>> on Combine My Settings with System Defaults. then...]
>> Click OK, and click on Vista-1 and click on Set as Default Profile. Click
>> Close.
>>
>> Now try opening a picture in WPG
>>
>> Ooops, almost forgot, for people who doesnt have Photoshop, u can google
>> any
>> free ICC profile or go to:
>> http://www.adobe.com/digitalimag/adobergb.html
>> Download these free ICC, and install some..or..well... i tried installing
>> all of them anyway... Just extract them, then right click and select
>> Install...
>>
>> Now go to Vista Control Panel, open Color Management, and click on Add...
>> Scroll down and all of the installed ICC should be there. Pick one and
>> set it
>> default. [Again, u could click on Profiles and select Combine My
>> Profile...
>> but im not sure about this.] Click Close and you're good to go.
>>
>> Of course if it still shows the wrong colour just pick a different ICC
>> and
>> try it. First ICC i tried is the Adobe1998 one and it seems to be working
>> fine... Of course im no expert and if any of u experts sees the better
>> ICC in
>> there (there r like 10~15 of them in the ZIP), by all means correct me.
>>
>> THat's all.
>>
>> Hope that helps
>>
>>
>> "Dale" wrote:
>>
>> > That's why I love free markets. The more non-Microsoft solutions
>> > there are
>> > to problems with Vista, the more Microsoft will learn to listen to its
>> > true
>> > customers over and above its partners.
>> >
>> > Dale
>> >
>> > "Michael J" <MichaelJ@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> > news:854D98CF-E011-4620-A9F7-D59BD6C84261@microsoft.com...
>> > > Redbeaver,
>> > >
>> > > I opened your image in Vista Windows Photo Gallery and then again in
>> > > Exlorer
>> > > AND Photoshop and you can CLEARLY see the poor image quality in
>> > > W.Photo
>> > > Gallery!
>> > >
>> > > In Windows Photo Gallery:
>> > > 1. The image is much darker than the photoshop (reference and color
>> > > monitored image)
>> > > 2. The image exhibits obvious pixelation in the clouds in the center
>> > > and
>> > > center right of the image
>> > > 3. The image looks artificially saturated beyond the reference image
>> > > in
>> > > Photoshop (which is an ICC color aware environment).
>> > >
>> > > Everyone I've spoken to who now has Vista has noticed this problem.
>> > > To the
>> > > novice , the problem may not be apparent at first. However, to the
>> > > photographer and just about anyone else who is color aware, can see
>> > > this
>> > > problem. I really wish Microsoft will address this as soon as
>> > > possible.
>> > > Meanwhile, I have switched to Google's Picasa as my picture photo
>> > > gallery
>> > > (to
>> > > manage images) and it totally ROCKS. I encouraged those frustrated by
>> > > this
>> > > Vista Windows Photo Gallery problem, to try out Picasa - I think you
>> > > will
>> > > like it.
>> > >
>> > > -Michael
>> > >
>> > > "
>> > >>
>> > >> "Redbeaver" <Redbeaver@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> > >> news:A292B8D6-65E1-4047-8B44-AA8C6E2C5DFA@microsoft.com...
>> > >> > There you go, guys... sorry about the triple posting...
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Original Pic:
>> > >> > http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/189/errorla7.jpg
>> > >> >
>> > >> > as wallapaper/WPG/Paint:
>> > >> > http://img509.imageshack.us/img509/6475/errorvt6.jpg
>> > >> >
>> > >> > See what i mean? Anybody can correct this so far?
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Microsoft should fix this ASAP as WPG is the program i used to use
>> > >> > all
>> > >> > the
>> > >> > time with XP
>> > >> >
>> > >> > Thank you............
>> > >> >
>> > >> > "Redbeaver" wrote:
>> > >> >
>> > >> >> DARN!! i uploaded the wrong picture... i will upload another one
>> > >> >> at
>> > >> >> home....
>> > >> >> sorry, guys... im at the office now...
>> > >> >>
>> > >> >> Ah yes, and i forgot to mention, and since i couldnt find the
>> > >> >> edit
>> > >> >> button,
>> > >> >> here goes:
>> > >> >>
>> > >> >> My system:
>> > >> >> AMD X2 3800+
>> > >> >> 2Gb RAM
>> > >> >> 2x7900GT on SLI using Forceware 97.46
>> > >> >> Samsung 205BW
>> > >> >> Vista Ultimate OEM
>> > >> >>
>> > >> >> Thanks!
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> >
>> >

I just bought a 22 in. Samsung monitor (225BW) and was having the same
problem. Thanks for the fix

Hey, thanks for the solution, but there's still a problem there. Now in WPG, my photos are slightly undersaturated. See what I mean:

http://www.filologica.be/zandbak/untitled.jpg

on the left is WPG, with colour management enabled. On the right is how the image should be (my mother has very red cheeks), in paint.NET, a program that isn't colour management-aware.

I've tried just about everything, but I can't figure out how to get the colours natural.

Can you? Please do tell me!

EggHeadCafe.com - .NET Developer Portal of Choice
http://www.eggheadcafe.com

I have been having trouble with my Photos screen saver. Last week it just
stopped working. Instead of showing the pics it just goes black. The same
thing happens when I try to view a slide show in either WPG or just picture
viewer. I was wondering if anyone has any ideas on what may have happened.

Thanks

System:

Intel Core 2 Extreme 2.66 Ghz
Nvidia 8800
Vista Ultimate OEM

On Sat, 31 Mar 2007 08:56:49 -0700, bluppfisk wrote:

>Hey, thanks for the solution, but there's still a problem there. Now in WPG, my photos are slightly undersaturated. See what I mean:
>
>http://www.filologica.be/zandbak/untitled.jpg
>
>on the left is WPG, with colour management enabled. On the right is how the image should be (my mother has very red cheeks), in paint.NET, a program that isn't colour management-aware.
>
>I've tried just about everything, but I can't figure out how to get the colours natural.
>
>Can you? Please do tell me!

The short answer is get better video software. What Vista includes is
very basic. I assume, perhaps incorrectly most people know that it is
mainly intenced to get your feet wet.

It's your luck day, I'm a video professional. How serious are you and
how big is your budget?

For starters you can't do color managament on a computer if the final
output is going to be playing off a set top DVD player hooked to your
tv or something like that because of different color space issues. If
you only intend to play the movies you make off a computer, then
ignore what I just said, don't matter. Otherwise all professional and
if you're serious you too should only do color correction on a
external monitor that's fed a signal from your computer via firewire
and and A/D converter so you're correcting in the correct color space
NTSC or PAL, not the third color space your computer monitor lives in.

Next it depends where in the world you live. The USA and Japan run
under NTSC standard, most of the rest of the world except for Russia
run on the PAL standard.

Before I get carried away, the basic concepts you need to understand
is luminance (brightness level) expressed as a waveform and what a
histogram is which shows where on the color spectrum the video signal
falls. If you don't see those two very basic elements and you can't in
Movie Maker, then you're just groping around in the dark and at best
will be reduced to playing hit or miss. Better software gives you such
tools and many others. With such tools you can begin to adjust your
video so it has the proper brightness, gamma etc.. If the luminance is
too high, the picture is "hot" and will distort the video and
everything you try to do to correct it, much like a poorly exposed
photograph. Like you can with Photoshop for still images, better video
software allows you to adjust curves and levels to get the video back
into balance. To get natural colors, after you adjust luminance and
levels, then you set a black and white point which removes color cast,
then the flesh tones almost adjust themselves or are very close
without you needing to do anything. As you may expect you can then
boost or reduce the saturation if needed to give the subject natural
color.

On a budget, download Virtual Dub. Totally free, and actually very
good, but the down side it is geeky to use. Do research on the web,
many sites devoted to it. The key to using it is learning about it's
many filters. Without them, you only get basic editing. Simple, some
come with it, others, often better all over the web. You just build a
filter list. Many filter open a seperate window and show the video
after the filter is applied.

For under $100, Sony's Movie Studio is quite good. It is the little
brother of what I use, Vegas, also by Sony. It isn't cheap, but you
get what you pay for. If you're willing to invest hundreds, and
considerable time to climb the steep learning curve, this absolutely
is best way to go on the Windows platform if you want professional
results. What I use and so do many other professionals. That's a
secret. Don't tell anybody. ;-)

Find out more here http://www.sonycreativesoftware.com/default.asp

Fair warning you can download trials, but the MPEG-2 encoder and some
other things are crippled. Still once you try real video editing
software you'll never go back to toy software. I'm not trying to be
cruel, but Microsoft Movie Maker is, well a toy at best and very
clumsy to use. I tried it several times, just shook by head.

I'm glad I'm not the only one having this issue. If you go into slide show
mode it is fine, but in large preview it is over saturated and looks like
crap.

It is the whole picture viewer because the white to the left and right of
the picture appears an antique white/yellowish color.

On Mon, 9 Apr 2007 19:26:02 -0700, smopoim86
<smopoim86@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:

>I'm glad I'm not the only one having this issue. If you go into slide show
>mode it is fine, but in large preview it is over saturated and looks like
>crap.
>
>It is the whole picture viewer because the white to the left and right of
>the picture appears an antique white/yellowish color.

Sounds more like a video driver issue or your monitor isn't calibrated
correctly or your monitor is set to the wrong color temperature or
something more along those lines. I don't see anything wrong with any
image I just looked at in Photo Gallery when viewed if the image
doesn't fill the viewer window.

To test, I used the snipping tool to capture the image while it was in
Photo Gallery. I then pasted it in Photoshop, then used the RGB eye
dropper tool to test the area you say appears antique white/yellowish
on your system. Mine tested in Photoshop shows the entire white border
area as R 255, G 255 and B 255. Proving NOTHING is wrong with how
Photo Gallery is displaying the images. I'm viewing on a HP Ultra
Sharp 24 inch wide screen LCD monitor.

Maybe others can repeat the experiment if they have Photoshop or a
similar high end graphics application that accurately reports RGB
values on a pixel by pixel basis.

After much searching and messing about I have found a solution which has
worked for me and my Samsung Syncmaster 205BW.

http://forums.microsoft.com/MSDN/Sho...85804&SiteID=1

Hopefully this should resolve the issues for those of you that are still
trying;

Regards,

Eldoylio

"Simon Cobb" wrote:

> I'm running Vista Ultimate RTM on a high end system. I just loaded 60-odd
> JPG images taken with a Nikon D40 DSLR onto my PC and viewed them through
> WPG. Given this was a brand new camera and these were the first images I had
> shot, I was horrified with their quality and initially assumed my camera was
> faulty. The images were terribly over-saturated, unsharp and noisy. I then
> opened the images for editing in Microsoft Digital Image Suite. Lo and
> behold, the images are sharp and properly saturated.
>
> While I'm relieved that my camera is performing correctly, what on earth is
> going on with WPG to cause such appalling display characteristics?
>
> Incidentally, I saw similarly poor results when I viewed the images in the
> new Slide Show viewer.
>
> Anyone else seen similar results? Is there a fix?
>
> Regards,
>
> Simon