Can't Access "Default User" folder in Users Folder

Wandering Flame · Apr 13, 2010

No matter what I do, and how much I edit the security settings on that folder (not that it lets me even do that) I can't access this folder for some reason?

What's the deal? Thanks.

This is on Windows 7. I have two admin accounts. I can't access it from either account.

niemiro · Apr 13, 2010

Hello,

I don't know why you want to, but you have to fiddle quite a bit with the permissions.

Navigate to the folder (Default User) and right click on it and select Properties.
Under the Security tab, click Advanced.
Under the Owner tab, click Edit.
Click "Other Users and Groups".
Click Advanced.
Click "Find Now".
Scroll down and double click on Everyone.
Click OK THREE times.
Click on the Permissions tab.
Under type Deny, single click on it and click Remove.
Click OK.
Click Edit (now on the standard file Property window under the Security tab).
Click Add.
Click Advanced.
Click "Find Now".
Scroll down and double click on Everyone.
Click OK.
Single click on Everyone and then tick the "Full Control" box under Allow.
Click OK TWO times.

This will get you in, but I don't know why you want to. Don't fiddle with anything in there.

Richard

Wandering Flame · Apr 13, 2010

Well I already did screw around with it. In fact I took out its contents, deleted the folder and re-created a folder with the same name. I don't think the "new" folder functions the same way as the old one. I could be wrong, but anyway...this is a copy of my post over at Windows 7 forums:
_____________________________________

This has seriously depressed me for some reason and am still wondering if I can just make a new "Default User" folder that had the default permission settings and that functions the same way. I thought by deleting it, it would fix the problem but now I so regret doing that...and want it back

I know I can simply create a folder here and call it "Default User"...but that wouldn't exactly make it just like the one I deleted. Because the folder I deleted was a junction folder as logicearth said, a new folder I can just "make" will not also be a junction folder like the one I deleted, or, can I make it a junction folder as well?

I can say though that I DO HAVE the contents of the folder I deleted, but it's not in the original "junction" folder I deleted. Can I RE-CREATE a junction folder and put the original contents back into it?

Someone please help me out, especially you logicearth. Thanks.

Also, I was going to ask, since you said Default User points to "Default"...

Ok, if I deleted the Default User folder (or, went into it and edited its contents) does that affect the "Default" folder as well, since Default User is a shortcut to it? I mean I guess it does...since Default User is a SHORTCUT which means it sends you directly to "Default" like you said...

So I was wondering, can I just re-create a junction folder in the "Users" folder and call it "Default User" and have it point to the "Default" folder like before (of course, keeping in mind that if I edited the contents of "Default User", I essentially edited the contents of "Default" since I think "Default User" is a shortcut to it)? I still have the contents of the folder I deleted (the unedited contents) so perhaps I can put these unedited contents back in "Default", and then re-create the junction folder belonging to it, and then call it "Default User" and put this junction folder in the "Users" folder. This would revert everything back to normal and I can stop regretting trying to take control over something I'm not supposed to, and screwing around with it.

Thanks, for those that will help. If I need to clarify anything more, I can.
_____________________________________________

I just don't feel right when I'm the admin of my own computer and there's something I CAN'T access...because it doesn't make sense. That's why I fiddled around with the permission settings to get into it.

Well, after reading about what it was (a junction folder) I wanted to reset its permission settings to what they were intially, but I forgot what those permission settings were.

Also, because I wanted to change its icon back to what it was (it changed to a folder with a lock symbol on it, but it originally was a folder with a shortcut symbol on it) I tried moving it from the "Users" folder to my Desktop, and then back into my "Users" folder, basically replacing the original with a copy (actually, it just transfered the contents of the copied folder into the original folder, and replaced the contents of the original folder). So, the CONTENTS of the folder are the same. I just need to know what were the original permission settings. Do you think you can tell me what your's are? Especially if you have Windows 7. If you have Vista, can you still tell me what your permissions are set to for that folder, so mine can be the same like before?

So basically, I just want it to have the original permission settings back, and by telling me what your's are I will have the best answer since I don't think I can get the answer anywhere else.

niemiro · Apr 13, 2010

Hello,

Do you need the folder or not? I think that it is only a couple of mb so I can send it to you if needs be. Also, to create a symbolic link or junction, you use a free program from Sysinternals: Junction v1.05

However, setting the permissions will not make a big difference. If you are still having problems, then restoring the permissions will not fix it. However, my permissions are:

Under Properties, Security, Advanced:

Deny Everyone List Folder/Read Data
Allow Everyone Special
Allow SYSTEM Special
Allow Administrators Special

Owner:

SYSTEM

This will not fix any problems, so if you have problems, pipe up now! I personally would not bother.

Richard

Wandering Flame · Apr 13, 2010

What is pipe up? :huh:

I was wondering how to check if the current "Default User" in my "Users" folder is still a junction for what it was initially, basically whether or not "Default User" is still a junction, since if I figure that out, there's no need to re-create a junction.

Also thanks for the security settings. I was wondering, does the advanced settings automatically adjust the settings in the original security tab? Basically where it lists groups and usernames, and the check boxes for each group/username...?

Also, where it says "inherited from" in the advanced settings, I noticed that after changing one of the listings at least once, what it says for that listing is "not inherited" instead of what it initially had, which looked like a directory like C:\ etc. etc.

niemiro · Apr 13, 2010

Wandering Flame said:
What is pipe up? :huh:

Means tell me now, so if you do have problems, then tell me now (pipe up now) Just an expression, sorry I confused you as it is probably not used wherever you come from.

I was wondering how to check if the current "Default User" in my "Users" folder is still a junction for what it was initially, basically whether or not "Default User" is still a junction, since if I figure that out, there's no need to re-create a junction.

You can use junction.exe to do that, however I am still trying to work out the exact syntax as it is messing me around with Default User

Also thanks for the security settings. I was wondering, does the advanced settings automatically adjust the settings in the original security tab? Basically where it lists groups and usernames, and the check boxes for each group/username...?

Should do, but you need to check.

Also, where it says "inherited from" in the advanced settings, I noticed that after changing one of the listings at least once, what it says for that listing is "not inherited" instead of what it initially had, which looked like a directory like C:\ etc. etc.

It should be Not Inherited, as we don't want to it copy the C:\Users folder, but to be special!

Richard

Wandering Flame · Apr 14, 2010

I'll just not bother with this and do something else. Thanks for all your help.

Wandering Flame · Apr 14, 2010

Actually never mind, I am back with this again.

You said to tell you if I have any problems going on, well how do I find this out?

How do I check if there's any problems with the junction or the folder it links to or symbolizes? Should I create a new user account and see what folders it makes for it?

Also I'm a bit confused as to ALL the things junctions are for...

At first I heard they are for 2000 and XP compatibility issues, then elsewhere I heard it's for the default settings for a new user...

Those two sound completely different to me to be honest.

Wandering Flame · Apr 14, 2010

niemiro said:
Should do, but you need to check.

Can you tell me the groups and usernames listed in the security (general part) tab and which boxes are checked and which are not, for each user/group, just as a final confirmation? That would pretty much relieve me for the most part.

I know THAT doesn't make a difference, but I just want everything to be like it was before...and as I said above, can you tell me how to check if anything isn't working like it should with the junction? OR what it links to...I thought I can check this by making a new user account, and checking the folders that are automatically created for that user account, and see if it matches with the "Default" folder...

But, there's probably also another way to check if there are problems, something having to do with it's ability to deal with XP and 2000 compatibility issues...but I don't see what I can do in this regard to see if it does that job, correctly or not.

Wandering Flame · Apr 14, 2010

You can forget all that I guess, because over at Windows 7 forums some people were telling me that I can do a System Restore, or a Repair Install, or a Startup Repair to undo the crap I did regarding the "Default User" junction and the "Default" folder, since if I messed around with the junction then I essentially messed with the "Default" folder since all the junction does is link to it.

Wandering Flame · Apr 14, 2010

niemiro?

Ed Canuck · Apr 14, 2010

If you can restore with a Restore Point prior to your playing with the Users folders, this is absolutely the solution to your problem.

The Junction Points are included in the folders for backwards compatibility, so that, for example, an XP program that stores data in the old Documents and Settings folder gets redirected to the Users folder - see Svrops.com - Windows Vista Junction Points. I don't understand why some of these are there, e.g. All Users folder is redirected to Program Data, but All Users\Application Data is also redirected to ProgramData, so you get a recursive loop.

However, from personal experience, I know that screwing around with these is sdoimething you do at your own peril. I've had to reinstall twice as a result.

Typical Microsoft transparency. If you look hard enough in their site you can find out what the structure is, but I haven't been able to find explanations for many of them.

Ed

Wandering Flame · Apr 14, 2010

Ok bro, tried system restore and it didn't work. In fact, why should it? System restore IIRC fixes system errors, not default settings for a new user. Could be wrong but nonetheless, I restored way before the incident and nothing happened, so I undid the restore to keep my recently downloaded programs.

Startup Repair is most likely my next try...

As for when you say "installed several times" damn, you were a victim of this crap too? Did you accidentally go in that Default User folder/junction or whatever, do something and now you can't open up NEW user account? Because that's what I can't do.

And did you have to do CLEAN re-installs? Because I was told over at Seven Forums that a "Repair Install" (different then clean install) can fix the problem.

Remind me to ask later what's the difference between a clean install and a "repair install"...

Ed Canuck · Apr 14, 2010

Simple question.

When you deleted the Users\Default User folder, did that also delete the Users\Default folder?

If not, the fix is simple.

Ed

Wandering Flame · Apr 15, 2010

I don't even know where the Users/Default folder is dude. I NEVER saw that in my users folder...despite seeing the junction for it (Default User) even when "Hide protected system files" was checked in folder options. I want to smack Dell so hard...

So, how do I check "Default" folder even exists anymore?

-EDIT- ok, I was able to go into "Default" by manually typing in the folder address Users/Default.

And I confirmed whatever I do to "Default User"...the change shows up in "Default" as well, indicating the both are linked.

However, I doubt this will be an easy fix as you said, because I cannot even create new accounts anymore. It automatically logs me off any new account, saying User Services can't load up.

I can log on accounts I created before the incident though.

In other words...I deleted the Default User "junction" folder, which caused my Default folder to have nothing in it. Then when I placed the Default User "junction" folder back into Users from the recycle bin, the Default folder regained the stuff back i.e. what is inside the Default User junction folder.

Even though I supposedly still have the junction and the Default folder intact, something is clearly wrong as I cannot create new user accounts and log into them.

Ed Canuck · Apr 15, 2010

The attached is what your Users\Default folder should contain (produced using following command):

C:\Windows\System32>dir c:\users\default /A /s > "C:\Users Default.txt"

I think the only critical file is NTUSER.DAT (but I wouldn't bet the farm on it). You can create the others directly or by copying from your own Users folder. You could also try copying the NTUSER.DAT file from Windows\System32\Config\SystemProfile.

If the actual Users\Default folder still exists in your Recycle bin, I'd try checking to see if any/all of these files are still there, but that's unlikely, and restoring that folder directly instead of the "Users\Default User" folder. The only entry "Users\Default User" needs is the junction point redirecting to the Users\Default folder.

The Repair option might do it for you. If it doesn't work as is, I'd try deleting the whole Users\Default folder and retrying.

Otherwise, sounds like a reinstall if you need to add a User ID...

Keep in mind that I'm flying by the seat of my pants here; as I said, screwing around with these folders is dangerous, and often brings the "law of unintended consequences" into play.

Ed

niemiro · Apr 15, 2010

Hello,

Sorry for my late reply. I am currently on a minibreak and I cannot do much off my iPhone. All I can say is that zipping up the folder did not work and did not keep the symbolic links. A repair install probably do the trick, bu you would need an SP2 disk or slipstream it to SP2 (really boring) Good luck,

Richard

niemiro · Apr 15, 2010

Hello,

Sorry for my late reply. I am currently on a minibreak and I cannot do much off my iPhone. All I can say is that zipping up the folder did not work and did not keep the symbolic links. A repair install probably do the trick, but you would need an SP2 disk or slipstream it to SP2 (really boring) Good luck,

Richard

Wandering Flame · Apr 15, 2010

SP2??

I have the Windows 7 CD that came with the laptop I bought last week...

I'm definitely considering to do the repair...as for the attached file, dude, isn't that a text file? Where would I put that? And would that even work, considering that's from Windows Vista and I'm on 7..sorry if I didn't mention earlier that I have 7.

-Edit-

wait Ed...are you saying that as long as I still have the "Default" folder (note by the way that this was never visible to me, EVEN THOUGH its junction was which is kind of idiotic, and I went into the "Default" folder by texting "C:/Users/Default" in the address bar) and I just put the text of that attached file into:

C:\Windows\System32>dir c:\users\default /A /s > "C:\Users Default.txt"

That it would RE-CREATE the junction? Thereby undoing everything I did to it?

Sorry if I mis-understood your post, but I think when you were saying "create the others from your user folders" you meant, if I only included the NTUSER and nothing else.

But if the solution is as simple as copying text from that file and putting it into that address (which is what I think you're saying) then cool, but I could be wrong about that guess.

Ed Canuck · Apr 15, 2010

Hi Flame,

I know absolutely nothing about Windows 7; your profile says Vista 32-bit, so that's what I assumed we were talking about. I assume the Users\Default folder is similar, but...

The text file wasn't intended for for you to use to recreate the folder. It's just a listing of the Users\Default folders/files on my system to show you what should be in yours. It was created in a Command Prompt Window, using the command

dir c:\users\default /A /s > "C:\Users Default.txt"

which creates a text file of the results instead of just listing them on the console.

I think you might have to clear the check box next to "Hide protected operating system files" in Folder Options to be able to see the Users\Default folder in Explorer.

No, restoring the Default folder won't recreate the junction point in "Default User". The junction point acts like a shortcut, so that if you created a file called "C:\Users\Default User\MyFile.txt", for example, it would be written to the "C:\Users\Default" folder instead. You could refer to it using either path. However, junction points have some peculiarities, and I confess I don't know what they all are. I believe that, for instance, if you delete a junction point in Windows Explorer or use the Del command in a Command Prompt, it will delete both the junction point and the target, which is what happened to you (and to me!). If you delete it using the RD command in Command Prompt, though, it'll just delete the junction point. And deleting the Target folder won't delete the junction point, nor will you get an error message.

I'd recommend you try the Repair option; failing that, reinstall. If you don't intend to add any new user ID's, though, you could just leave it. It shouldn't affect anything else.

Ed

Can't Access "Default User" folder in Users Folder

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