Dell, with Vista on-it

simono · Aug 27, 2010

Hi, Simono here,

A friend has allowed me to take there PC home with me because they can not start-it anymore.
This is what I'm seeing. After hooking everything up, I turned it on. The machine powers-up, all fans running, and sits there. There is no sounds of cycling, or of any normal sounds you usually hear from a start-up. I've worked on this same computer about 6 months ago so I remember what it does.
I restarted is several times to try and catch the screen display for booting in safe mode but, there's not even a flicker on the screen... it remains solid black.
Sense the OS is Vista, I put in my recovery disk that came with my computer, hoping this would trigger a response. I tried restarting the pc several time with the disk in but the screen remains black... again, not even a flicker.

Is there a way to reset the system besides unplugging it, or something else I can try?

Thanks,

Simono

niemiro · Aug 27, 2010

Hello,

I am not very good at this sort of thing, you need to wait for somebody else, but I can add a few things.

Does it make any funny noises, in particular, anything that could pass for a deliberate bleep?

What is the full model of this PC, laptop or desktop?

Thanks!

simono · Aug 27, 2010

Hi niemiro,
Thanks for the reply... I'd have to say that all the times I restarted it, I heard nothing that sounded like a beep... Just power-up, and fans running. It's weird, none of the normal sounds of a unit booting are there... like it's froze... right after you push the power button.

It's a Dell PC....
Model no. Dcne
Serial no. 5Ph4WC1

Mag. Date: 042507
Express Service Code: 12424348081
Ref. no: 06120
Dimension C521

Patonb · Aug 27, 2010

This is most likely a hardware issue.

Eeww even worse its a slimline.

Okay, Try resetting the CMOS, by poping out the battery, with it unplugged from the wall, and press the power button a few times. Then put the battery back in. Try booting.

If its a no go, ensure everything is tightly in place. Reseat the ram, gpu, if it has one, and all the power plugs. Then try booting.

Being a slimline type setup, skinny case, parts aren't very abundant.

But, you can try replacing the ram, and the psu, well sorta, by using a spare "normal" psu and just plugging in the main power stuff.

Looking at the service tag, It has a pci-e gpu, take it out, and try using the onboard. See what happens.

Somethings gone bad, so its gonna take some fiddling.

simono · Aug 27, 2010

Thanks Patonb,
Yea, I'm not a be fan of dell so slimline works....lol I'm gong to need your help again because I'm a little confused on how to reseat the gpu... Ram I just remove and put it back in I believe.

Also, not sure what you mean by removing the pci-e gpu and using the on-board... I'm sorry that I have to ask you to ex-plane more.... but also need some understanding on the psu, and how to go about using a spare. All I have here at home is a downed emachine with everything in it... will anything work from there?

Patonb · Aug 27, 2010

No problems on having more questions than you started...

Yup, thats how you reseat the ram.

1st does the monitor plug into the motherboard, or does it go into a card?
Heres how to add n remove a card:
YouTube - Tiger How-To: Install a Graphics Card in Your PC

Yes, the emachine can be useful.

You can use the full size psu from the emachine to plug into the dell. But because it won't fit in the case, you'll have to run it outside the case.

But you can just unplug the one in the dell, and just plug the emachine one in.
Watch this Youtube vid as a "how to" change a psu.
YouTube - How to install a Power Supply

More questions, just ask away.

simono · Aug 27, 2010

Thanks so much on this.... and yes, the monitor plugs into the motherboard. The card jack is buggered-up and they told me the last time I worked on it, that they just started to use the other... and it did work. I must say that now... I'm hooking my monitor to it and it says: "no signal."

So far I've pulled the battery, pushed the power button in and out several times, and removed the card... tried to start it (nothing), replaced the card... and battery and still nothing.... Sometimes I get a power button that stays yellow all the time when I let it run. Then I tried my vista recovery disk and the power button was green. But the next time I did the same thing... it was yellow all the way through an not a flicker on the screen. I don't now if this tells you anything or not.

I'm now going to follow the videos and keep an eye on this posting for your response, again... thanks for your patience.

Simono

niemiro · Aug 28, 2010

Hello,

I don't think that there is any need to replace the PSU in this case, because if you look up the diagnostic lights, solid amber means "A pre-POST failure has occured. The system has received a Power Good from the Power Supply." I take this to mean that the mains is switched on, AND that the PSU is working, though correct me if I am wrong.

For info on how to remove specific components for this PC, please see the good Dell manual: http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/dimc521/en/OM_EN/RP333A00.pdf

If you notice any other light configs, please tell us. You may be interested in Page 48 of the manual so that you know what you are looking for.

All that pre-POST really means for you, is that the screen cannot work, for any one of many reasons.

Richard

EDIT: You may prefer this manual style: http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/dimc521/en/sm_en/index.htm

Patonb · Aug 28, 2010

I agree with niemiro on the amber light thoughts. So don't worry about the psu yet.

That leaves the cpu, mobo or ram.

You can try pulling 1 ram stick and try 1 stick in a slot at a time.

Though I think the system should beep odd theres ram issues.

simono · Aug 28, 2010

OK... here's what I've done. After about 15 restarts, I was able to get a green power button light. This is the only time any of the 4 lights will work. Amber is just that... only the power button stays amber and nothing else is lit.

Anyway, With a green power button, I have 1,2, and 3 lit in green above the green power button... In the manual, "Thanks niemiro" 3 lights read: "Routine system activity subsequent to video initialization." Further.... "Watch your monitor for on-screen messages."

I finally have something on the monitor... and it says: "Diskkette drive 0 seek failure"
Press F1 to continue, F2 to enter setup....
Last time,had green a little earlier and it said to do a setup, it's not this time, only the diskkette thing.

I have pulled both cards (if that's what they are) the smaller one under the larger one has 2 telephone looking jacks side by side. Not sure what it's for but, at one time, they were using an adapter on the larger one so they could plug-in the monitor. It's all buggered up now and It looks like you wouldn't be able to plug anything into it. Although, everything was like that the last time I worked on it... and it worked... sorry for so long a post.

Well, that's where I'm at with it and want to wait for your instructions for my next move. F1? or F2.... I have it running and am afraid to shut it down.

simono · Aug 28, 2010

After reading you response again, you ask if there was any other lights I can see... I do see one at the bottom of the mother board toward the back of the pc. It's continually on unless I unplug the pc. It's yellow, and reads: AUX_PWR_LED.

Also the manual talks about a 5th green light that is for the hard drive... it reads: The hard drive activity light is on when the computer reads
data from or writes data to the hard drive. The light might also
be on when a device such as a CD player is operating.

I haven't seen this light a all.....

Simono

Patonb · Aug 28, 2010

Easy question first... The phone plug board is the modem and/or network card.. The 5th light is basically showing that the computers thinking. Since its not starting it can't quite think, so i wouldn't expect to see that yet. The AUX_PWR_LED shows the computer is plugged in.

Take out the buggered card... Its not needed now, so one less thing to worry about.
Did You get it to boot after removing the video card?

Now the hard stuff

Can you reliably boot to the f1 or f2 options?

At the f1 or f2 question, hit f2. That should get you into the BIOS, which is the mobos settings.

Its now sounding like that from all the booting the Vista has gone and got messed up, or the hard drives gone bad.

If you have the Vista disk, you should beable to stick it in and reinstall/repair Vista. I'm not that knowledgable on Vista repairing though.

Question... How fasts your internet?? A good check on if the systems running now, would be to d/l a Ubuntu cd and run that from the dvd/cd drive. This would give you a fully running computer without haveing to install anything or use the harddrive, but its almost 700megs. You d/l the file and burn it to a cd, then stick it in the dvd drive, and it can run.

You'd get it from http://www.ubuntu.com/desktop/get-ubuntu/download

Powell · Aug 28, 2010

I don't know if this is even remotely connected with your problem but it is a suggestion.

I had a somewhat similar problem running XP. The system would boot up then crash, boot up then crash. After trying every suggestion that I was given I finally took it into a service centre and they eventually ran a continuity test on the motherboard and found out it had a crack in it.

niemiro · Aug 29, 2010

Powell said:
I don't know if this is even remotely connected with your problem but it is a suggestion.

I had a somewhat similar problem running XP. The system would boot up then crash, boot up then crash. After trying every suggestion that I was given I finally took it into a service centre and they eventually ran a continuity test on the motherboard and found out it had a crack in it.

Thank you very much for your opinion. We need all the help we can get (sort of!)

Right Simono, first we need to know if the screen consistently works. If it does not, then we should not be thinking about that message yet. Keep restarting it. I know you don't like to hear that, but that is what is good for it.

I was also thinking MoBo if nothing else works, as my Dad's Dell got a bad stick of memory, and the power light was solid amber, but it happily beeped at us. Again, if it was the graphics card, I don't see why it couldn't beep.

However, first, we need to see how reliable this screen message is.

Richard

simono · Aug 29, 2010

Thanks you Powell... Sense the kids use the computer, who knows what could of happened in the last 6 months or so... well keep this in mind.

niemiro,
OK.. This is what's I've done... I've went ahead and Pushed F2 which is setup and I went to the boot sequence page and moved "boot to the hard drive" to the 1st position. On my emachine, this helped boot faster but here, it wouldn't do a thing when I tried to start it. I unplugged the the pc and plugged it back in... I think it reset itself because now it does as it has been doing. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to get it to give me a green power button which is the only time it will display on the screen.

Sorry about that niemiro, I did this out of frustration and before you posted back. I'll say that during a amber display... there is no lit numbers (ever) to follow or will my vista disk display anything on the screen... even after countless restarts.

I'm going to do what you talked about before... taking and moving memory sticks around, placing One in at a time, and try and get some kind of a beep... at this point, there isn't one.

Oh, On the event log in setup... The last date was about a month ago, when they said it went down. It read: keyboard error. The dates after that are all Jan. probably cuz the clock messed-up but for the life of me, I can't remember what they said. I should of wrote them down, sorry

simono · Aug 29, 2010

I wasn't sure if I answered your question about how the pc is displaying on the screen. I have found that as long as I get a green light... there's display. And I'm able to navigate around. But getting a green light is the problem now. I've just changed the memory around, using only one stick at times and back to two..... still no beep or green light. I'm now trying to restart, unplug and plug back in and restart, removing the battery after unplugging and putting it back in and plugging it back in and restarting several times but, still... no green light. I pray that when I move the "boot the hard drive" to the 1st position, it didn't make matters worse.

Todd

niemiro · Aug 29, 2010

Hello Todd,

Moving the hard disk to first will not have caused it to not work like this. This is not a problem, and is certainly well worth trying. I do not complain.

However, the way I read this (that event log proved far more helpful that you ever imagined) is that this is not producing a screen, and we believe it to be possibly the MoBo.

We have ruled out the PSU, and the memory (for certain now, it was just a guess) and I don't think it is the GPU. That leaves the only crucial piece of hardware left. The MoBo.

The keyboard is plugged directly into the MoBo. If the MoBo were to break, is it possible that you might get keyboard problems?

MoBo. The hardest and most complex hardware to fix. Probably a write off. I will see what Patonb has to say first though, I may be completely wrong. Just be prepared for the very worst.

Richard

simono · Aug 29, 2010

I was afraid of that but hey.... I got the green light again and this is what I see on the screen...

Diskette drive 0 seek failure
keyboard failure
Invalid configuration information - please run setup program
Alert! System battery voltage is low
Alert! Previous shutdown due to thermal event

I'm not sure how to run the setup program, do you think it would help or even be worth a try? Also, I was reading about "setting it back to factory settings" You lose alot but at this point... heck.

I just want to try some things and hope the MoBo isn't the final diagnosiss. I'm prepared for it though :cry:

Patonb · Aug 29, 2010

If you can't get it to boot to the setup screen, Its either cpu or mobo.... most likely mobo.

However, the 2 last alerts are odd. Usually a dead battery will just not remember the BIOS settings. The thermal event usually means its over heated... but itd be hard to do without it booting.
You do have a keyboard plugged in correct? The battery error and keyboard error have me thinking... I wonder if the bios requires a keyboard to boot.

Try a different keyboard, as if the keyboard is needed, and yours is going, it'll cause problems

What we know:

Youre using the onboard video card, so if its bunk, you are screwed. RAM switching had no effect so thats okay, and I'd be surprised if the psu has an issue.

At this point, unless you have another amd cpu, it'll be hard to diagnos the issue. The next issue is it being a slim and a dell, where Dell uses alot of propriatry mobo and cases.... You can't just buy cheap replacements.

It might be time to go get the mobo tested, but now comes the cost vs reality. It could cost more than its worth to find and fix it.

Try the keyboard, and maybe a new battery... maybe.

I really would like to see a consistant boot before we tackle the setup issue.

simono · Aug 29, 2010

I replaced the battery with one from an emachine that I use for parts. #'s were all the same but have no idea if this battery is any good.

I am in the setup screen now and the boot sequence has changed from what I set it to.
Floppy (not present)
onboard cd-rom drive
usb-fdd (not present)
dbq (not present)
bootable hard drive ( This has no # preceding it? it says on the screen this: Only devices that are preceded by a number are bootable... (the space key controls whether a particular device is bootable) does this mean anything?)

the last three things in the boot sequence are usb devices and it reads (not present).

I've tried to reboot with a new keyboard unplugged and plugged in and still didn't make a difference but, that was yesterday and now that I have the setup screen... I'm trying to do as much as possible before trying to reboot again. I will leave the good keyboard plugged in from now on.

Yes, I think I'm using the onboard video card... as I still have not put the 2 cards I removed, back in yet. Ones a network card (looks like it has phone jacks) and the other just above it... a larger card you can plug into.

I want to write what I see on the event log:
all dates are the same now... 01/01/2003
all say "post error" except the last one....
floppy drive 0 error
floppy drive 0 error
keyboard error ( I didn't boot with this good keyboard connected... I plugged it in afterwards).
CMOS checksum error
CMOS battery failure
And last... instead of "post error" it reads "out of range" CPUO Temperature.

Todd

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